Peter, this site is frequented by so many pilots that there is a good chance someone will try whatever procedure we will agree in this thread as being the right one. Rolling non-aerobatic aircraft is as likely to kill them as penetrating clouds on a VFR flight in the mountains or descending below minima on an IFR approach.
I know many aerobatic pilots; they don’t all always do everything by the book, but I have NEVER heard from any of them about rolling non-aerobatic aircraft. Not that it could not be done – probably any aircraft could be rolled, no matter how large. But it should not be attempted. And they know how cłose to winning the Darwin prize they could get by trying.
Indeed. If I remember correctly someone here tried to roll a King Air a few years ago. The wings were all wrinkled afterwards and the aircraft was a write off. Obviously they were quite luckly.
Centurion_Flyer wrote:
I know many aerobatic pilots; they don’t all always do everything by the book, but I have NEVER heard from any of them about rolling non-aerobatic aircraft.
Unfortunately, I have seen an aerobatic pilot rolling a PA28.
The obituary for a US lawyer, who died in his 90s, and who had been a WW2 Lockheed test pilot, mentioned he had barrel rolled his Citation to celebrate his 80?The birthday.
Everyone who does sim training on light jets has a go at rolling the sim, it’s almost part of the syllabus! 
Peter, this site is frequented by so many pilots that there is a good chance someone will try whatever procedure we will agree in this thread as being the right one. Rolling non-aerobatic aircraft is as likely to kill them as penetrating clouds on a VFR flight in the mountains or descending below minima on an IFR approachQuote
Very much agreed. For that reason, there is quite a bit on this topic which I have not and will not post. Fly your aircraft as trained in it, and within its published limitations.
Rolling is one of the maneuvers which novice pilots think is easy, because skilled pilots make it look easy. It is also the maneuver most likely to be messed up, because the pilot lets it go wrong midway through, and recovery at that point is impossible within limitations. The Harvard pilot in the video clip let it go wrong, and this was obvious at the first quarter of the way around. The mistake was correctable up to the inverted point, but fatal if uncorrected after that, at that altitude.
Competent training in suitable aircraft is available. I took it, and you should too, if you want to fly aerobatics. It’s not intended as elitist to say that, but as correctly stated, would you fly IMC without training?
Centurion_Flyer wrote:
Peter, this site is frequented by so many pilots that there is a good chance someone will try whatever procedure we will agree in this thread as being the right one. Rolling non-aerobatic aircraft is as likely to kill them as penetrating clouds on a VFR flight in the mountains or descending below minima on an IFR approach.
Pilot_DAR wrote:
Very much agreed. For that reason, there is quite a bit on this topic which I have not and will not post. Fly your aircraft as trained in it, and within its published limitations.
I disagree. With that line of reasoning, we shouldn’t discuss IFR flight techniques either because there are non-IR rated pilots on the forum. Or indeed any flight techniques because non-pilots may read this forum and get ideas.
It’s not intended as elitist to say that…
Maybe not, but it does come out that way. “Security through obscurity” doesn’t work. On the contrary, discussing aerobatic flight techniques could well make more people interested in getting aerobatic training.
Peter wrote:
Presumably there must be a method whereby a skilled pilot can barrel roll any plane he gets into. Can such a procedure be described?
What you see in that video is not a barrel roll, it’s a so called aileron roll. It’s one of the first things you learn when training aerobatics, and it is dead easy. Start at slightly above cruise speed, pull up to 20 degree or something depending on the aircraft and roll rate, center the stick and apply full aileron left or right and hold it there. The plane will roll at max roll rate starting 20 degree up and will finish the roll about 20 degree down. Then you will get a close to 1 g throughout the maneuver +- 0.5g or thereabout in the pull up.
The dangerous thing is not pulling up before the roll. Then you will exit the roll at 40 degree nose down at high speed. Not centering the stick will get you through a kind of barrel-ish roll with an exit pointing down. Another thing is if you have never done it, some will get an urge to stop rolling half through the maneuver, and instead pull the stick, again resulting in a high speed dive that may not end good.
The maneuver itself is dead easy and there is absolutely no danger connected to it, other than odd things you could possibly do if you have never done it. It is what is called a 1g (or low g) maneuver, and all airplanes can do it.
A barrel roll is very different, and much more difficult. It takes practice to do right. A slow roll is probably one of the most difficult maneuvers of all, and takes years of practice to get it right every time.
I think maybe people who have (and are) flying RC aeroplanes have a very different concept of physics and aerodynamics than the average GA pilot. To see what an aircraft actually can do, take a look at this video :smile; I have seen even better, but you get the idea.
I have just got this from an ex RAF guy:
Airborne_Again wrote:
I disagree. With that line of reasoning, we shouldn’t discuss IFR flight techniques either because there are non-IR rated pilots on the forum. Or indeed any flight techniques because non-pilots may read this forum and get ideas.…
Maybe not, but it does come out that way. “Security through obscurity” doesn’t work. On the contrary, discussing aerobatic flight techniques could well make more people interested in getting aerobatic training.
Holy Moses ! Didn’t initially read the whole thread. I agree 100% with Airborne A. We are pilots, we are free as birds. However, very often pilots are their own worst enemy, as is apparent here. It all come down to proper training with an instructor. Don’t fly IFR without training, don’t fly aerobatics without training. Don’t do a spin without training. That is, not of you want to stay alive with a reasonable good probability.
