if you have an average of €25 to 30k p.a. to operate, that means at 100 hrs per year that plane costs between 250 and 300 Euros per hour,
Sorry, NO. Those numbers can come only from a disastrous purchase followed by a disastrous operating model, and probably a ripoff maint. company. I can say this with some confidence because I see invoices for work on various “disaster project” planes; invoices which can never be published. The EASA / European system merely makes it a lot easier to extract such sums from owners who are in a corner and with their back to a wall.
A TBM would cost only 2x that, and that assumes the maint. co. does the whole Socata list every time (not Part 91).
As for girlfriends…. most of them won’t fly in small planes anyhow, but if so, they might as a GF but will have a fit as a wife if they ever find out the cost.
My comment about no gurl being worth a £500 plane rental cost was obviously tongue in cheek 
but if you marry a woman who has a fit when she discovers the cost of your principal hobby and objects to it, you’ve made the same unwise choice in women as you made in planes Of course, that this happens (with both planes and wives) does not surprise me at all; I’ve done it too (the latter, and she is now easily worth a TBM850, if not an early 900 ). But one has to learn from mistakes. Men just simply don’t (especially not with women; most men seem fully capable of marrying a woman who hates more or less everything they enjoy – here).
Peter wrote:
Sorry, NO. Those numbers can come only from a disastrous purchase followed by a disastrous operating model, and probably a ripoff maint. company.
Well, you have 2 people here who published their figures and I have added my average over the last years.
Don’t forget that prices vary greatly depending on where you live. It is alone a huge difference if you are in a low or high wage country alone. And quite apparently N-reg appear to be a yet again totally different story.
Peter wrote:
A TBM would cost only 2x that, and that assumes the maint. co. does the whole Socata list every time (not Part 91).
I have no clue how much one of these costs, only word of the mouth that the annual maintenance on average for a plane like this is likely to be more, without one minute flown.
Prices I have heard for the Vision Jet are about 1500 Euros per flight hour with a yearly use of around 200 hrs.
23k€ for how many hours in a 160hp Cherokee ?
70 hours
Some details:
- Maintenance & Repairs
May 2021
June 2021
August 2021
October 2021
December 2021
December 2021
December 2021
Total € 10.035,12
2.819,89 € Repair of Minor-Squawks
168.25 € Repair of Minor-Squawks
145.00 € Philips 20W50 + Camguard für
1.750,00 € 50h Inspection + Misc. Repairs
75.99 € Oil Analysis 100h
75.99 € Oil Analysis 50h
100h / Estimate Annual Inspection 5.000,00 €
Here some details on a 50hr inspection with some minor squawks fixed:
Almost €115 per hour labour incl. VAT? That will add up pretty quick I guess.
Yes, but rather normal in Central Europe. At least for renowned shops at major airports in the bigger cities. Similar as for car shops, which are actually sometimes more expensive. Obviously, a mom and pop shop in the nowhere, at a small GA airfield will be less.
Still, the big differentiator regarding typical maintenance cost is very obviously whether you get everything done by a shop (which does NOT mean doing the whole MM!) or whether you get involved yourself / with buddies, freelancers etc. Most owners will simply go for the former (no time, no wrenching skills, no interest…). In most cases, it has NOTHING to do with “airfield politics”.
Indirectly it is everything to do with airfield politics, because if EASA66 guys could freely work freelance and could work in your hangar, the “no interest” factor would vapourise, because “money talks” and a 10k Annual would cost perhaps 5k. Only the laziest owner would pay 10k when he can do it for 5k. Even in CHF 
My last Annual was “owner assisted”, with me and my son doing stuff, with the A&P/IA. Most companies don’t allow that. At the hourly rate mentioned, the labour bill would have come to €14k! A lot of small jobs got done; paint touch-ups, avionics checks and tweaks, etc.
The entire GA “ground picture” from top to bottom is shaped by airport politics. Much more so than by EASA and NAA regulation, actually. EASA never prohibited what I describe above.
Peter wrote:
The entire GA “ground picture” from top to bottom is shaped by airport politics.
My last annual the aeroplane was parked outside the EASA shop. Annual expired.I had used these guys a few times. I know the owner well. Can I rent a corner in the hanger and bring in A&P. SORRY NO. Can I get you to give my aeroplane a 100 hour annual as per my Owner Handbook Maintenance schedule. SORRY NO.
We operate to EASA LAMP. That will be the schedule we will use. OK.
There are some corrosion issues. Can I come in and do that work myself. YES. However when I went it was now a NO.
Invoice, after a quote of £5500, £11800. Sorry we discovered under LAMP some stuff we had to attend to. Customer happy, NO. Happy with aircraft condition. NO, NOT REALLY.
Its the way it is. Not do it again though.
Agree with @Bosco
I could’ve gone to a smaller airfield and paid half the labor cost. That takes two flights and a day of travel. Not worth it to me.
Could have also done everything in one of the hangars. Nobody cares.
It’s not airfield politics around here.
Could have also done everything in one of the hangars
By who?
Snoopy wrote:
It’s not airfield politics around here.
Not here either. Freelancing part 66 people are very difficult to find in Sweden. There is a general shortage of piston aircraft mechanics and it will get worse, given their average age. Young people prefer working jets. And why should you freelance if you’re offered a position with a shop?
