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Brexit and general aviation, UK leaving EASA? (merged)

which most probably would make English cars unsellable within the EU.

I thought the only UK cars which got sold on the mainland Europe were the stolen ones

Admittedly I sold my Soarer to a French buyer, but that was an old car by then – €1000. Had it been €1100 it would not have made any difference – he wanted it for racing…

When voting is not compulsory, this can lead to a significant advantage to those groups. Witness the relative success of extremeist political parties vs their actual support base.

The biggest problem I see is that the EU is its own worst enemy when it comes to PR. Most people find it very difficult to think of anything good that EU membership has done, whereas the negative things (regulations, mostly, and many of them crazy) are all around us and very visible. Obviously there are some good things (e.g. level playing fields in many areas) but they are not so visible.

So… I can’t see an immediate impact (especially a negative one) on aviation if the UK left the EU. Can anybody think of anything else?

Last Edited by Peter at 03 Dec 10:36
Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

The biggest problem I see is that the EU is its own worst enemy when it comes to PR.

Definitely! Especially considering that 80 percent of what they do is done in the name of “consumer protection”, so supposedly for our own best… But they miserably fail to explain properly, how their complicated regulations are going to achieve that.

So… I can’t see an immediate impact (especially a negative one) on aviation if the UK left the EU. Can anybody think of anything else?

As I wrote: Visa and TSA screening. And mandatory hi-wiz-jackets . Apart from that, flying to the UK can not get worse than it already is.
And I don’t know if I will continue to go to Farnborough for my simulator recurrents. This will depend very much on what the Pound is going to do after the UK leaves. Already now it would be cheaper to go to Dallas or Wichita for training, the only thing that justifies to go to the UK (which I personally much prefer!) are the two travel days that are saved.

Last Edited by what_next at 03 Dec 10:51
EDDS - Stuttgart

Visa and TSA screening

Is that kind of thing really likely, given that Norway and Switzerland don’t need it, for GA?

Also the rest of non-EU Europe (Serbia, pre-EU Croatia, Macedonia, etc) do/did not apply those requirements.

It would not be in the interest of either side to be vindictive about this. The UK is a massive customer of EU companies, and vice versa.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Is that kind of thing really likely, given that Norway and Switzerland don’t need it, for GA?

Right now, that’s hard to imagine. On the other hand, after leaving the EU, the UK will have to look for new friends. And if they move closer to the U.S., who knows what will come from that? Already now, a big portion of the post 9/11 security measures at our European airports are dictated by the Americans!

EDDS - Stuttgart

From my point of view and many other german citizens I would appreciate UK leaving the EU since this would help us to overcome the monster of bureaucracy and EURO-dictatorship not only in terms of silly regulations regarding GA. And sure we can visit each other and stay friends without a fear of war in a better future.

Berlin, Germany

I think a referendum is a dangerous thing. I dont think the average non-politician / experienced european businessman will ever fully be able to digest and make a judgment on the facts of being better off in or out. I can understand the appeal of parties like UKIP as they force popular topics like immigration onto governments agenda, when otherwise it might not have been. Our Prime Minister knows full well the threat of UKIP and has to claw back those who left his party, back into voters next time around.

I think a lot of people often just remember the hype (the banana brigade who apparently would walk around your local market verifying the curvature of your banana (and I do mean banana, thats not a euphimism for something else)). And as I said before it is a case of “what did the Romans (change that to EASA) do for us”. I have no doubt it is a beaurocratic job-fulfilling, gold plating, career self-serving organisation, but besides the IMCr I am not sure I can recall one good decision that has come out of it. Thats not to say I dont believe there has been any good, as well as bad of course, but its not publicised and if you take the UK as one entity – we dont speak with one mind – we have millions of different views depending on many factors and the time of day, or what we had to drink the night before.

Im not saying dont give people choices and referendums, no one wants Robert Mugabe as a leader, but if we got a referendum and the majority wanted out, either Mr Milliband or Mr Cameron may well have some serious backpeddling to do, or as in Ireland, keep having referendums until you get the result you want.

From my point of view and many other german citizens I would appreciate UK leaving the EU since this would help us to overcome the monster of bureaucracy and EURO-dictatorship not only in terms of silly regulations regarding

You want the UK to leave? And it would really help other nations overcome the monster of bureaucracy?

You want the UK to leave? And it would really help other nations overcome the monster of bureaucracy?

From what I understand, “highflyer” is based in the UK! For us here in Germany, going back to our original pre-JAR regulations would indeed be a big step forward. I always had the impression that a lot of the JAR regulations came from an Island across the English channel…

…in terms of silly regulations regarding GA…

As someone who earns his living within the GA sector, I would like to know what silly regulations these might be? (Two or three examples would be enough!) Again – we had big changes going from national rules to JAR. But JAR to EU and now EU to EASA has brought more facilitations than additional complications, at least here in Germany (e.g. easier medicals, unlimited validity of the license, the universally recognised LAPL replacing the national PPLs, the IMC rating for those who care, almost unregulated light aviation like gliding, motorgliders, microlights, 120kg-microlights).

Last Edited by what_next at 03 Dec 12:43
EDDS - Stuttgart

On the other hand, after leaving the EU, the UK will have to look for new friends. And if they move closer to the U.S., who knows what will come from that?

The UK has more in common in its legal system and legal traditions with the US than with continental Europe, so you could hope to escape EASA and adopt the FARs Some country in Europe needs to shake things up before the descent to rule by EU politburo is complete, and that applies to more than aviation. I personally think some country will, or a bunch of them will, sooner or later. The advantage of now is that less (or no) violence will be involved.

That said, there were reasons the US revolted and left UK rule, and many of those reasons are still in place. An independent UK would not limit the functions and power of central government, or reduce taxes and over regulation either. The best the UK could hope for now is to move away from rule by unelected EU committees, and a return to the principles of English law. That might not be a bad thing, especially since sooner or later I think it’s going to happen anyway.

But AFAIK there is a 10% import duty on cars from non-EU states which most probably would make English cars unsellable within the EU.

Doesn’t seem to bother the Americans, Japanese and Koreans much, they continue to sell plenty within the EU. Even some European BRANDED cars are made outside the EU, for example Mercedes have factories all over the place including South Africa and the USA; Mercedes C Class saloons for the UK market are built in East London, South Africa.

There may be other reasons for the UK to stay in Europe, but tariff barriers are unlikely to be the killer. Why would the EU have a free trade agreement with Norway and Switzerland but not with England? They wouldn’t, and even the “get out of Europe brigade” envisage us remaining part of the EFTA

Darley Moor, Gamston (UK)
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