I think this survey deserves more aircraft types added…
All,
Thanks a lot for the (as usual) very good insight.
Of all the questions I asked this morning, the Cirrus one is the most difficult to answer. It is so very tempting – and it is so very expensive.
the only people who you might convince that will save money with the Cirrus, might be your wife.
And I don’t even have a wife to convince (which, OTOH, is a big +1 for the Cirrus, eh? I really just need to convince myself).
A “G3-GTS” is not a turbo by the way, that would be a nornally aspirated SR22, 3rd generation.
The aircraft in question has the Tornado Alley Turbo fitted though, as advertised. Should have been more specific referencing the type. 
but the difficult part nowadays is the (avionics) systems and “managing” the flight and the aircraft properly.
The next thing on my To Do list (regardless of what else I do) is to get checked out on the PA 28 there which has an AVIDYNE. I suppose that should help with getting to grips with handling the SR22 eventually, if I do it.
I recommend STRONGLY that you do a proper Cirrus transition training course with a Cirrus Certified instructor. Please don’t settle for anything less.
a medium skilled pilot has mastered an SR22 in one hour
Hhmh. Those two statements are a bit contradicting. To what extend is the official transition training course not a money printing machine for those who run it?
No contradiction, if you had copied my statement in its entirety…
Yes, you can fly the SR22 in one hour … but to understand it takes some time.
The AVIDYNYE ENTEGRA is really easy to learn though IF you have experience with the GNS430. If you are fluenzt with the 430 the Entegra is a piece of cake. But don’t look down to the backup instruments the first two hours for checking the speed, as i did.
Then it’s a “TN” version, which is cool
One interesting observation is just how expensive rental is for doing longer trips.
On this trip from Shoreham EGKA to Salamanca LESA, I filled up at LESA with pretty expensive avgas for €580 (199 litres) and I had lots of headwind. The flight was 5.25hrs airborne, which on this SR22 rental, and adjusting for a 20% higher TAS of the SR22 (if hiring wet, you don’t need to fly economically – you go for “best power” 
) comes to just over €2000.
Yes Peter but that comparison is not relevant. You had to buy the TB20. In rental there is a return on capital element and a maintenance reserve as well as profit on top of the direct costs.
I would do this.
If you havent flown glass before acquire a PC simulator and spend as much time as possible getting using to the system. Those hours cost nothing and there is no point learning the systems in the air, which is what most people do.
After that you will probably find the biggest issue is the Cirrus is reasonably slippery (and reasonably quick) so in my experience pilots struggle with circuits and approaches for a while and they can get behind the en route navigation. The twin I fly is more work in the circuit but it is much easier to get the speed under control.
In terms of faults the Cirrus will run out of rudder authority a little earlier than you might wish in strong cross winds. It will get away from you a little quicker than some on instruments if you dont maintain concentration. Other than that it is very pleasant to fly. You will read it is designed to fly on autopilot especially because hand flying with the side stick is not very pleasant. That is not true and inevitably comes from those who have never flown a Cirrus or who have little time on the aircraft. It is very rewarding to hand fly and you will be entirely happy to hand fly any mission in its entirety. Of course, as with any instrument capable aircraft there is nothing to be gained by hand flying it on instruments any more than needs be.
Yes Peter but that comparison is not relevant. You had to buy the TB20. In rental there is a return on capital element and a maintenance reserve as well as profit on top of the direct costs.
Obviously, yes, but my example illustrates the massive disincentive which the pilot has to
It costs of the order of €100-€150/hr to fly an extra hour if you own the plane.
It costs (in this case) €470/hr if you rent the plane.
This directly impacts how much you are going to enjoy flying.
In fact, somebody renting out an SR22 (and who is getting a reasonable utilisation) at €470/hr is making loads of money out of it. I would accordingly expect the utilisation to be very poor; very few people are going to rent at that rate. From where I am, the proverbial lunch at Le Touquet would cost the best part of €2000. Hands up all those who would pay that…
This directly impacts how much you are going to enjoy flying.
You mean just because in one case you will be presented with a bill right after the flight, whereas in the other case no? Come on…
At xxx flying hours a year, the cost for renting will be totally equal as the cost of owning. Whether that xxx is 50, 100 or 150 hours depends on a lot of factors and is another debate.
Also, you seem to imply that 470€ for the SR22TN is – relatively speaking – expensive.
Well, on the free rental market in Germany, TB20s go for 350-380 Euros an hour (like it or not). So even if we say 350, then we are talking about a difference of 120 Euros. for that, you get
-210 knots instead of 150
-an almost brandnew aircraft instead of one that is 10, 20 or 30 years old
-cabin comfort
-CAPS
-glass cockpit
-TKS
Puts things into perspective, me thinks.
in Early Modern English, used at least 150 times by William Shakespeare – Gut Boscomantico, you are lighting things here …Puts things into perspective, me thinks
