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Customs and Immigration in Europe (and C+I where it is not published - how?)

What's the difference? We call them "douane" and they do Border Control.

The difference is massive. One is concerned with the movement of people (immigration), the other with the movement of goods (customs). This is pertinent to travel within the EEA between countries that are non-Schengen, e.g. UK, Switzerland, Norway. They do not require customs (being part of the EEA), but do require immigration. Herein lies the problem for flights between the UK or Switzerland and France, Germany, etc, as discussed in another thread.

The difference is massive. One is concerned with the movement of people (immigration), the other with the movement of goods (customs).

Isn't it the other way around?

If you look at the AIP for Lelystad EHLE It says Customs: during AD OPR HR and Immigration: NA.

So apparently it was "Customs" who was doing my Passport control as Immigration is Not Available?

So apparently it was "Customs" who was doing my Passport control as Immigration is Not Available?

The 'Marechaussee' (always loved that mangled French!) may be different, but hey, this is Holland. If you don't believe me, just look up 'immigration' and 'customs'. Or, indeed, peruse one or more of the other threads here concerned with the withdrawal of the aforementioned services.

This is pertinent to travel within the EEA between countries that are non-Schengen, e.g. UK, Switzerland, Norway. They do not require customs (being part of the EEA), but do require immigration.

? In your example only the UK is non-Schengen. Switzerland and Norway are indeed Schengen States, but not members of EEA

If you fly from Schengen to Schengen = no immigration (passport control) but eventually Customs if EEA to non EEA.

Flying from UK to Norway means Customs and immigration (passport control). UK to Germany only immigration. France to Germany nothing.

But in some countries Customs and immigration is obviously done by the same workforce.

EDxx, Germany

The point I would make (again ) is that in "international aviation" the word used is "Customs" and that is the word found in e.g. the various airport directories.

It is also the word understood by ARO staff if you ask them whether you can fly there.

So, in

Flying from UK to Norway means Customs and immigration (passport control).
UK to Germany only immigration

both of those need Customs airports.

Maybe the immigration / passport control distinction is to be found in the depths of the AIPs?

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

At my airfield EDFZ no permanent Customs is present, however, if you inform the airport management 24h in advance, they will arrange either the border police for passport control ( e.g.flights originating from UK ) or Customs or both to show up at your ETA. So you can fly directly from the UK to Mainz. I wonder whether EDFZ is listed as Customs Airport in your directory?

EDxx, Germany

I am in in Greece today, departing to Egypt tomorrow. I arrived from Germany which -- just like Greece -- is both Schengen and EU. I did a fuel stop in Serbia but that was a technical landing and I did not leave the transit area. So in fact I did a Schengen/EU to Schengen/EU flight.

Given that Sitia has almost no traffic, the officers had all their attention focused on me. I told them I just arrived from Germany and will continue to Egypt tomorrow. Unfortunately their English was not good enough to figure out that I am coming from Schengen and only tomorrow will go to Egypt. They heard Egypt and decided to search my bags. I told them I will now go to downtown Sitia, eat grilled kalamari and drink Alfa beer, potentially load my bags with drugs and other stuff and tomorrow leave to Egypt at which point I would recommend they search my bags. They didn't get that. So they searched my bags (but not the aircraft). They also spent 10 minutes looking at my German passport asking me at least 10 times whether this is a German passport. The fact that it said "Germany, Deutschland, etc." all over was not enough to convince them. This was very funny but the customs officer was very good looking.

Nobbi,

in my airport directory (Jeppesen) it sais for EDFZ:

Customs: O/R. PPR from Airport Ops for flights to/from non-EU countries at least 1 hr /Sun/Hol 2 hours.

The correct term for an airport with IMMIGRATION is AIRPORT OF ENTRY. This however is only awarded to airports which have regular immigration services and customs availabe. Jeppesen lists these under 3.3.1 Airports and Aerodromes with regular Customs clearance and labels them in the airport directory as Airport of Entry.

All other airports are under 3.3.2 Other Aerodromes with customs clearance which implies, that customs is PPR or at least not there regularly and has to be organized/pre-ordered.

Flying to / from Switzerland and Norway therefore needs simply customs only, but no immigration per se. Flying to/from the UK and other Non Schengen States requires full immigration facilities.

Achim,

the fact that they decided to search and be obnoxious might well have had to do with the fact that with some Greeks Germans are not overly popular.... I had a similar experience in Germany showing my Swiss ID shortly after Steinbrueck's "Cavalry" rethoric where we were held at the aircraft for over 1 hour and our posessions taken apart and dumped onto the wing and rigorously searched. When, after we were told to pack our stuff together again, I asked if there was any special reason for this, one of the agents told me abrpubtly to shut up or face further investigations on the "Wache".

Sometimes it helps to know where one is welcome...

LSZH(work) LSZF (GA base), Switzerland

Switzerland and Norway are indeed Schengen States, but not members of EEA

We are both right - and wrong. Both countries are EEA members (not EU!), but are part of Schengen.

And we really think some border copper is gonna figure it out ;-)

172driver, sorry I meant of course EU when I wrote EEA. Flying from Norway to Germany or v.v. you still have to pass customs ... and pay for goods you import - maybe at a lower tax rate

EDxx, Germany
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