Well placed French people say these measures are due to (essentially) a panic in France due to the realisation, in the light of recent terrorist events, that they have an ineffective police force. Unfortunately there seems to be a total disconnect between this panic and the need to support local economy. For example I cannot believe removing C+I from Courchevel – the playground of the rich if there ever was one – was at all looked at, and that was 2012, in the pre-panic days.
Unfortunately where there is a loser there is a winner, and the winners are the handling outfits. I have seen that around here, where the airport lost practically all ME business for a year or two and it never really recovered. You can guess who pushed for mandatory handling over x kg…
As long as Switzerland is not part of the customs union (“Zollunion”) all aircraft crossing the border between Switzerland and France are required to exclusively use airports open to international traffic, despite the fact that Switzerland is part of Schengen.
Therefore (my conclusion): if by government decision an airport is stripped off its status as “point de passage frontalier” (border crossing point) it can no longer function as an airport “open to international traffic”. I think, this is what the people of the Aéroclub d’Annemasse ar referring to.
But, you need just 1 policeman to perform this function – like they do in e.g. Croatia.
Everything above that is job protection / job creation / union-driven job demarcation / empire building / etc.
Nothing to do with controlling the passage of goods requiring Customs control, or controlling terrorists (who can in any case walk right across the border, because mainland Europe has no borders).
Peter wrote:
For example I cannot believe removing C+I from Courchevel – the playground of the rich if there ever was one …
Courchevel? That has some appeal to the self-flying adventurer maybe. But the real rich ones don’t go there. Poshness factor zero. They still go to St.Moritz or Davos or Kitzbühl or maybe to Cortina if they love the old-fashioned way. And they don’t care if there is an “altiport” close by because they will be taken to their chalet by helicopter from wherever their Gulfstream can land.
I think that we will see a quick decline of all those “chambre de commerce” (= taxpayer) operated country airports in France. The taxpayer does not want to subsidise rich boys any longer. The real rich ones don’t care and pay what they have to, see the landing and parking fees at St.Moritz/Samedan and the less rich ones don’t bring any valuable business to the region anyway but go there for their pleasure only. Sorry to say it so bluntly, but this is how it is. I’ve been in the business of flying rich people long enough…
The magic words are EU and Schengen. If you belong to both, life is easy (flying wise). If your voters opted against one of them (or both as will soon be the case in the UK) then life becomes more difficult. Time to move, I would say.
I think that we will see a quick decline of all those “chambre de commerce” (= taxpayer) operated country airports in France. The taxpayer does not want to subsidise rich boys any longer.
I agree with the first bit; I have been saying this for ages. But not because the taxpayers care IMHO. I don’t think most of them know, and those who do know will know most of them aren’t rich. French club GA is mostly short low level runs. I don’t see this as indicating rich boys.
I think the reason is crappy airport management – like Dinard not sending out an invoice for a year. That had to explode at some point when the beans run out.
But here we are not talking about airports closing. This is a local police move, presumably reallocating staff.
Peter wrote:
But here we are not talking about airports closing. This is a local police move, presumably reallocating staff.
Sure, it’s not about closing. It is about charging for the service. Those airports/airfields who have always charged for customs and/or border police (like Le Bourget to name the best business airport in Europe) remain fully open 24/365. Those who have not charged the cost of the service to their customers do not get the service any longer. Like everywhere else in the world.
what_next wrote:
The UK has been non-Schengen ever since. With paperwork and border control and everything. Has this had any impact on GA traffic to and from England? I would say no. One arranges oneself easily.
No, because they have the GAR way, which means you can land anywhere with proper pre-notice. That is a huge difference from closing off almost the whole GA infrastructure from Airport of Entry. And btw, for Switzerland the customs requirement still does exist, the French seem to have confused it again as they did the first time when they announced that flights from Switzerland did not require ANY cross border controls. So beware, it’s not as easy as it sounds, particularly as France also has the Schengen status suspended partly.
Mooney_Driver wrote:
…particularly as France also has the Schengen status suspended partly.
Yes, I know. I have been warned that I can be fined up to 5000 Euros for every passenger I carry to France who does not have an ID card or passport with him. Most of the time I forget to ask them and luckily no one has been caught without passport yet.
what_next wrote:
Courchevel? That has some appeal to the self-flying adventurer maybe. But the real rich ones don’t go there. Poshness factor zero.
You’d be surprised. I recall at least two PC12 operators who were flying there regularly from Switzerland with guests for skiing who can no longer do it. Tyrolean even flew there with a Dash 7 at the time. Ok, from Austria it would still work, provided France re-instates Schengen fully. Don’t know the status of Courchevel there.
what_next wrote:
I think that we will see a quick decline of all those “chambre de commerce” (= taxpayer) operated country airports in France. The taxpayer does not want to subsidise rich boys any longer.
Quite a lot of those have equally subsidized scheduled services to Paris and other places. And I don’t think it’s the taxpayers, it is the ruling group, lead by a communist by the name of Holland and his merry men.
But maybe the way things are at these airports, they might be better off if they were ran commercially, but then they should get all services at least against payment.
what_next wrote:
The real rich ones don’t care and pay what they have to, see the landing and parking fees at St.Moritz/Samedan and the less rich ones don’t bring any valuable business to the region anyway but go there for their pleasure only
Samedan hat quite a firestorm of their rich customers. They don’t like to be fleeced like the next guy and are much more powerful to put their foot down. There is rumours enough that some of the regulars have special conditions one way or the other.
But still, Samedan and other such places ARE expensive BUT they do offer the required services. France denies those services altogether even against payment. That again is a big difference.
what_next wrote:
The magic words are EU and Schengen. If you belong to both, life is easy (flying wise).
Is it really. I understand that France has at least partly suspended Schengen and quite a few airfields are requiring pre-notice even from flights from the EU-Schengen area. Colmar is one of those, and they just lost their border status as well, which means they loose a LOT of training flights from Switzerland and valuable revenue. I understand that AOPA and other organisations are trying to stop this, but at the moment, getting into France means AOE for most purposes.
France denies those services altogether even against payment. That again is a big difference.
We don’t want to go down that road either.
Bergerac is now €50 for police attendance which could be worse, but Le Bourget would now cost me €700 or so (a bizjet friend was there the other day and asked them for a price for my 1400kg) and you bet the police charge is bundled into that… (no avgas though, btw). However Bergerac is also 24hrs PNR which makes it as non-useful for this purpose as Caen which is also 24hrs PNR.
I do find it odd though that somebody in France has not latched onto the idea of charging for police everywhere as an option for the customer. Set up a website, paid by Paypal 
Whoops, I better not say this otherwise the UK might stick a charge on the GAR form 
What’s going to happen is that a lot of French airports won’t see visitors from the UK anymore… they will go elsewhere.
I recall at least two PC12 operators who were flying there regularly from Switzerland
Quite a number of those, plus some TBM owners I know of. Quite a hassle to clear C+I with a turboprop, burning real money on the way down and back up.
