There aren’t that many light aircraft types of which I’m completely unaware, but @Ibra’s post has one photographed, the Oberlerchner Job. Interesting 
I can sleep with less ignorance now, me thinking it was an RV
The AIP also had this friendly note
That’s something AD operator pulled out of his hat and there is nothing in the law to back it, a bit like “online course for IFR to Cannes” (as far as DGAC is concerned and according to a senior DSAC sud-est guy there is no legal existence or basis for that online certificate, if there is anything they would put it on IFR plates to restrict their use) or the “blue prohibited circles in Toussus” (no prohibited airspace associated with these but AD operator unilaterally decided they are in AIP)
If no ATC in Chambery tower one can turn up with 1.5km visibility and land VFR, or 800m and takeoff IFR on 36, there is no legal text that says NO they can’t, the AD operator is not entitled to interpret weather or qualified to read it, let alone redefine minima for Golf airspace or uncontrolled AD in the AIP (only ATC & PIC have this legal entitlement, they hold something called FCL & ATCO qualifications with medicals & training, ah it feels great to say this )
However, the IAP IFR procedures (ILS, LOC, RNP) are prohibited in absence of ATC in Chambery, private operators are expected do their “own checkout” if they plan IFR or SVFR with ATC over there (fly reconnaissance flight in Delta VMC or fly it in simulator on their own)
For background, the restriction was only for commercial operators until this:
https://www.bea.aero/docspa/2006/n-ag060116/pdf/n-ag060116.pdf
Ibra wrote:
For background, the restriction was only for commercial operators until this:https://www.bea.aero/docspa/2006/n-ag060116/pdf/n-ag060116.pdf
Ouch. There is a reason we don’t have any LOC BC approaches in Europe…
Of course you will die if you fly an IAP badly and there is terrain… you could dig up any number of these accidents.
There is nothing wrong with back course approaches. The deviation bar (on an EHSI at least) works the same way as before.
But I think very few people in light GA fly IAPs to these airports.
In any case the OP is flying VFR so this is irrelevant.
There is a good number of super scenic places in the Alps, although far from all of them are in France.
Ibra wrote:
at’s something AD operator pulled out of his hat and there is nothing in the law to back it, a bit like “online course for IFR to Cannes” (as far as DGAC is concerned and according to a senior DSAC sud-est guy there is no legal existence or basis for that online certificate, if there is anything they would put it on IFR plates to restrict their use) or the “blue prohibited circles in Toussus” (no prohibited airspace associated with these but AD operator unilaterally decided they are in AIP)
It’s also absolutely not enforced. TBH LFLB ATC are pretty good and proficient (and even coming out of LFLP Annecy you will be transferred to them pretty quickly on any of the SID’s). For me LFLB is the airport next door, the ILS is interesting, as mentioned because of the missed, which you will want to have done in clear VMC before attempting it in IMC to realise how little margin you really have, the terrain is not very ’’friendly’’ for anyone going missed. It’s OK in our little machines but in a Jet it is proper James Bond stuff and you do not have much time to make any decisions. I did most of my Instrument training out of Grenoble and have flown many a hold and approach including missed ones at LFLB (again it’s next door).
On most of my flights I pick up my IFR with LFLB (usually join at LTP) and the descend from the VOR into LFLB is pretty steep. Customs (PPR) are rarely there and the tower is pretty helpful in checking (I often ask when coming back from lets say the UK which avoids me shutting down). It is then a simple IFR (literally I follow Rivers) from LFLB to LFHN my Homebase, follow the Rhone low level while avoiding the power cables (Genissiat one of the oldest power dams on the Rhone is one of the entry points to LFHN) which gets you below the mountains and into the steep valley LFHN is located in.. If you know what you’re doing (you need to be below 3500ft any way as to not clip the Geneva TMA) it’s all good, if you don’t, you could be in a lot of trouble. It is mountain flying, by any means in marginal weather…
the ILS is interesting, as mentioned because of the missed, which you will want to have done in clear VMC before attempting it in IMC to realise how little margin you really have, the terrain is not very ’’friendly’’ for anyone going missed
I agree, it’s tight inside you have valley & mountain in front and turn back would be tricky but anyone who is going there IFR or VFR in marginal weather need to get there in VMC or use some simulator: GoogleMap, Xplane…to get to know the area and have good ways to keep some situational awareness going (e.g. topo moving map)
ATC are really helpful when one has a doubt: I recall asking Geneva by phone how to depart from Annemasse with 800ft ceiling, they offered to cross the lake and climb on SID to Dijon, which is better than VFR scud run via Annecy as I don’t know the area very well and trying to pick IFR in the valley…
There is a reason we don’t have any LOC BC approaches in Europe
I would be curious if there are other places that have them? the report said Chambery & Annecy used to have them, I checked Annecy no longer have a BC LOC, for going missed at Chambery, I think it’s hardcore: you will need to set-up BC LOC past MAPT maybe while inside the “confusion cone”…
Toussus used to “clear BC LOC07 on initial approach to ILS25” but they replaced with “cleared for VOR070 radial” as any confusion would result in nipping Paris prohibited area
Guys, the OP is VFR. I now have another thread to edit-out when I get back from working on the plane.
Peter wrote:
Guys, the OP is VFR. I now have another thread to edit-out when I get back from working on the plane.
In that case LFKA Albertville is a very nice little airport to go into as is Grenoble Le Versoud, both require some French language (as does Annecy and Chambery outside ATC hours). Albertville and Grenoble have a nice airport restaurant that serves good food and are interesting from a VFR point of view. You can fly the lakes (which they will allow if you call up on time and follow the reporting points) and get into both. In summer, be careful as MtBlanc is now a restricted area (easy to get to from LFKA) and limited to local traffic (professionals working there). Fines are imposed!
Albertville requires an instructor checkout.
