Hi All,
I may do a trip back to the UK in September and it would be the first, since the Withdrawal Agreement ended, by private aircraft. I am pulling my hair out with respect to the GAR forms.
When I have flown back commercially, at the EU border I have always handed my UK Passport and EU National ID to the authorities and this has prevented me being input into the EU system as a 90-day temporary and getting a stamp. The EU guys have only ever looked at the National ID and the UK guys have only ever looked at the Passport.
Perhaps Aeroplus has a view, as I know he helped with the OnlineGAR.com software…. My issue is this, I may depart The Netherlands to the UK, and if I submit the GENDEC/GAR via Skydemon (for example) the same information will be sent to both the UK and Dutch. So I see the issue as:-
To the UK, a “UK entry GAR” and a “Dutch exit GENDEC” needs to be filled so:
– I need to fill out the forms with UK Passport details, so this will trigger the Dutch to “visit me” and expect to exit stamp my passport. But the EUID supersedes this as I have “Freedom of Movement” in the EU.
From the UK, a “UK exit GAR” and a “Dutch entry GENDEC” needs to be filled so:
- I assume to exit the UK I would need to fill out UK Passport details, and so this would then trigger the Dutch to “visit me” to stamp the passport again.
Is it just me, am I overthinking this? Or are the GAR/GENDEC forms not easy for Dual Nationals? In additional in the FAQs on the government guidance notes, it doesn’t seem to cover any Dual-national example or case.
Thanks in advance
Jon
Why not submit two separate PN/Forms with two separate details? you don’t have to send via OnlineGAR which does both
I agree sending the right data tend to “save you a visit” but I don’t see the issue of handing a different passport on the ground even if it’s not the one in your forms? I don’t recall anyone managed to stamp the ID card…
Interesting idea to submit two with focussed info.
I tend to advice against using Skydemon for travelling The Netherlands to UK. In my experience this can cause confusion at border crossing, where you don’t want to add to any additional confusion. I would file https://www.onlinegar.com/ for UK on my own account (NOT using the generic Skydemon account) and separate via https://www.gendec.eu for NL (also on my own account). From my personal experience and perspective this is the best way to avoid strange things happening.
Maybe a dumb question, but do you actually have two nationalities/passports? You mention EUID and a UK passport… I have French EU residence ID and a UK passport, but don’t have a second EU country passport. I’ve never thought about 90/180 days for residency except for tax purposes and my passport is randomly stamped in/out – sometimes yes, sometimes not, seems to be at the whim of the guy at the booth, I don’t think I’ve ever offered the EU residency ID (they do sometimes ask) and I travel at least once a month.
I’ve only flown privately a couple of times post brexit to the UK with an EU national, and IIRC with respect to border force (GAR) or douanes (PN), we saw the French once and the Brits once, so I don’t think that the passport/nationality comes into whether or not you get met. I guess it depend how much effort you want to put into filling in forms, because they may or may not want to see you anyway – it appears entirely random to me.
Regards, SD..
Maybe a dumb question, but do you actually have two nationalities/passports?
Yes, I do, have had dual since birth but never bothered getting two passports as it didn’t given me anything. However, long term I’m going to obtain the second passport. I think it would clear this issue up.
My biggest fear, as this happened to a friend in a similar situation, is having the UK Passport “triggered” on entry as being used for the 90-day visitor period. It caused a lot of issues as he “apparently” overstayed on the on UK Passport but his dual nationality with an EU state meant he didn’t. The authorities had no idea how to resolve it and it lead to a lot of tedious visits to various offices. In his case though is was a immigration officer on “autopilot” who scanned and stamped his passport.
I do not know enough about what happens with the GAR form. Is that used to “trigger” immigration processes? Or is it what actually happens in front of the immigration officer.
I tend to advice against using Skydemon for travelling The Netherlands to UK.
Any reason why? Apart from forcing different information. Myself and a lot of others have used it without issue. So I’m interested in your experience.
italianjon wrote:
I do not know enough about what happens with the GAR form. Is that used to “trigger” immigration processes?
Yes, it does trigger the automatic processes. Keep in mind, UK is part of the DigitalWorld … ;-). In your case I’d rather call the NCU or direct UK Border Force Office and discuss the issue in advance. Nothing more bad than border police trouble …
italianjon wrote:
Any reason why? Apart from forcing different information. Myself and a lot of others have used it without issue. So I’m interested in your experience.
Tim Dawson has a tendency to only treat basic standards (guess he must, given the small company running the product) and always assumes everything is basic service and delivered to them in suitable electronic format (which is not always the case as we all know the digital aviation data quality), while keeping his disclaimer ‘you are on your own and Skydemon is only a navigational aid without guarantee’. Skydemon is a fine and cheap product for not so advanced requirements, but I guess this isn’t a typical case for ‘easy’. I see yours as a non-standard issue with risk in probability and possible impact, so I would never rely on such a third-party software alone – exactly following their disclaimer.
In your case I’d rather call the NCU or direct UK Border Force Office and discuss the issue in advance. Nothing more bad than border police trouble
I agree with you. Because it’s the UK exit GAR that causes me the headache.
