National CAA policies around Europe on busting pilots who bust controlled airspace (and danger areas)

IIRC OCAS flight levels start at 3000ft AMSL or 1000ft AGL whichever is the highest.
So the lowest VFR FL is FL35.
Inside CAS often the transition level is
FL 50 or 5000ft. But on the approach charts for many airfields it says “transition level set by ATC”
It helps therefore to have 2 altimeters. 1 always set to QNH the other will be set to either or 1013 as the need requires.
Of course the UK does do things differently sometimes. I don’t think that regional QNH’s help here or it just seems that way and ATS don’t seem to help as much as they do in other countries.

Winston wrote:

The issue is that with a QNH of 965 you can fly from 4400’ altitude underneath a 4500’ base of CAS laterally into adjoining CAS at FL55 at FL57.

Impossible. What you are describing does not exist. I read your AIP and this is what is says:

3.1 The Transition Altitude within the UK is 3000 FT except in, or beneath, that Airspace specified at paragraph 4.1.

3.3 The vertical position of aircraft at, or below, any Transition Altitude will normally be expressed in terms of Altitude. The vertical position at, or above, any Transition Level will normally be expressed in terms of Flight Level. When descending through the Transition Layer the vertical position will be expressed by pilots in terms of Altitude, and when climbing in terms of Flight Level. The Transition Altitude and the Transition Level may be used concurrently in cruising flight, with vertical separation ensured.

3.4 Flight Levels are measured with reference to the Standard Pressure datum of 1013.25 hPa. In the UK, the first available Flight Level above the Transition Altitude is separated from the Transition Altitude by a minimum pressure interval corresponding to a nominal 1000 FT in the ISA.

3.5 QNH reports should be obtained from an ATS Unit. These QNH values are rounded down to the nearest whole hectopascal but are available at certain aerodromes in tenths of hectopascals for landing aircraft on request.

3.9 Airspace within all Control Zones (CTRs), and within and below all Terminal Control Areas (TMAs), Control Areas (CTAs) except Airways and the Worthing and Clacton Control Areas, during their notified hours of operation, does not form part of the ASR Regional Pressure Setting system.

3.10 When flying in Airspace below TMAs and CTAs detailed above, pilots should use the QNH of an adjacent aerodrome when flying at or below the Transition Altitude. It may be assumed that for aerodromes located beneath such Areas, the differences in the QNH values are insignificant. When flying beneath Airways whose base levels are expressed as Altitudes pilots are recommended to use the QNH of an adjacent aerodrome in order to avoid penetrating the base of Controlled Airspace.

4.1 The following Transition Altitudes apply to flights within or beneath the following Airspace:
Note: † Outside the notified hours of operation the Transition Altitude is 3000 FT.

Therefore, if you obtain the correct QNH and are below 3000ft or where applicable at the published active time at or below the different transition altitudes you cannot bust a lower limit of a CAS. That level while spatially lower than your position is not available so you can’t fly it. As per rules it doesn’t exist. But of course if you climb above the transition altitude then you are in flight levels and you should fly an appropriate level to not enter CAS without a clearance.

Now I have to say it’s my first time reading the UK AIP and I you guys sure like to have your own rules. And complicate things. For example I was perplexed to read this:

1.3 Where controlled airspace is vertically adjoined by Class G airspace, aircraft operating at the base (lower limit) of a control area or at the upper limit of a control zone or control area should comply with the requirements of Class G airspace. With the exception of VFR flights operating into or out of Class E airspace and where appropriate, complying with any applicable TMZ requirement, flights without an ATC clearance that are observed operating immediately above the base (lower limit) of a control area or immediately below the upper limit of a control zone or control area will be considered to have infringed controlled airspace.

1.4 When considering the vertical profile of a flight within Class G airspace, pilots are reminded to select a level that is compliant with SERA.5025(a) and ORS4 No 1423. In order to mitigate the risk of infringing controlled airspace, pilots are recommended to plan their flights to operate:
not closer than 2 NM from the boundary of controlled airspace.
at least 200 FT above the upper limit of Control Zones, Control Areas including TMAs.
at least 200 FT below the lower limit of a Control Area, including TMAs.

1.5 When operating proximate to control areas in turbulent, or in ascending or descending air masses, as part of effective Threat and Error Management, when able to, pilots may wish to consider increasing the 200 FT recommended spacing to mitigate inadvertent vertical deviations that could result in an infringement.

1.6 Pilots are further reminded that, when operating within Class G airspace within 500 FT of the base of controlled airspace, they should consider the risk of encountering wake turbulence generated by aircraft operating at the lowest available level within the controlled airspace above.

I mean they use this publication to give you recommendations how not to bust CAS? Wow. Amazing. But I can now understand where this attitude that you UK pilots seem to have towards CAS and ATS comes from. It seems to me as an outsider there is this huge tension between cowboy pilots flying without radio low level doing what ever and a very busy commercial aviation sector trying to do perform their activities safely. I also noticed you as private pilots on private flights are actually mandated to contact FIS to obtain clearances from Radar which was surprising to me. And I can now understand a little bit better why CAS appears to you as this elusive high society club that you have to beg to get in and most of the time wont be accepted.

Peter wrote:

Yes you get busted regardless of traffic – because of the +5000ft -5000ft artificial cylinder, 5nm diameter (or radius – NATS pubs vary on this; see previous posts) which is placed around any infringer, and which ensures most busts are “serious” because +5000ft puts you next to some airbus at 9000ft. I got sentenced to gasco for one of those.

And what about your “favourite” Southampton CAS? It has got Class D up to 5500 and Class A from FL55. I presume you’d have to request “not above 4500’” with such low pressure, otherwise you’d be in both controlled airspaces at the same time.
What does theory says in that case? Anyone?

Peter wrote:

The two don’t differ much at typical UK GA altitudes i.e. SFC to 2000ft What atmospheric conditions would you need for say a 200ft error at 2000ft? (the UK CAA man will bust you for 200ft into CAS – plenty in the MOR summaries I get).

It doesn’t matter. UK AIP clearly says:

5.5 Flight Planning
5.5.1 The levels at which a flight is to be conducted are to be specified in the flight plan:
In terms of flight level numbers for that part of the flight to be conducted at or above the transition level; and
in terms of altitudes (ft) for that part of the flight at or below the Transition Altitude.

5.5.2 The flight level or levels selected for a flight should ensure adequate terrain clearance at all points along the route to be flown, should meet Air Traffic Service requirements and comply with the cruising levels at ENR 1.7, paragraph 6.1, where applicable.

5.5.3 The information required to determine the lowest flight level to ensure adequate terrain clearance may be obtained from the appropriate Air Traffic Service Unit or Meteorological Office. A chart for converting QNH values to flight levels for this purpose is shown at ENR 1.7-5.

You are supposed to fly pressure altitudes, not GPS altitudes.

Airborne_Again wrote:

The video didn’t make any mention of the real issue.

I was thinking the same thing the whole time watching that video. He was supposed to read his altimeter to know his vertical position and look at SD only for the information about what the CAS lower limit was. Either he doesn’t understand this which is quite wrong and dangerous or played dumb to get out of trouble.

Peter wrote:

And what about your “favourite” Southampton CAS? It has got Class D up to 5500 and Class A from FL55. I presume you’d have to request “not above 4500’” with such low pressure, otherwise you’d be in both controlled airspaces at the same time.
What does theory says in that case? Anyone?

No idea but Solent owns the air up to 7k and London Control owns it above that. Normally Solent expects crossing traffic at 4000ft which is what I ask for. And I ask for IFR and then it doesn’t matter if there is cloud. The TA in most of the UK is about 6k; used to be much lower like 3k (ORTAC area for example – FL035).

Yes, but if you are IR(R), then it is an illegal flight, even under IFR.

Peter wrote:

Not sure if AA will do the calculation I asked for but it is awfully unlikely to get a 200ft error between baro and GPS, at 2500ft AMSL.

Unless there is a problem with the GPS/tablet itself – I’ve seen same tablets misreading ALT by 500ft+, after a long flight (lateral positioning is fine).

Peter wrote:

This is true everywhere in that you cannot rely on a CAS clearance anywhere. VFR traffic can always be refused so you always need a Plan B.

Wrong. Any flight can always be refused and must have a plan B. In fact this is a question in the question bank for ATPL:

hazek wrote:

The transition layer is always required to be min 1000’. Therefore you cannot be at FL55 if you have not passed the published transition altitude.

Just because FL55 isn’t available, doesn’t stop you busting it when the base of controlled airspace is defined as FL55.

hazek wrote:

It doesn’t matter. UK AIP clearly says:

5.5 Flight Planning
5.5.1 The levels at which a flight is to be conducted are to be specified in the flight plan:
In terms of flight level numbers for that part of the flight to be conducted at or above the transition level; and
in terms of altitudes (ft) for that part of the flight at or below the Transition Altitude.

Totally irrelevant. We’re not talking about flight planning or cruising levels here but rather controlled airspace entry.

hazek wrote:

Therefore, if you obtain the correct QNH and are below 3000ft or where applicable at the published active time at or below the different transition altitudes you cannot bust a lower limit of a CAS.

And this is part of the problem. It’s all very well if you sit in one location and watch traffic coming and going. But if you’re in an aircraft that is moving, a changing transition altitude is a recipe for a disaster. Oh, and I should add that the changing of transition altitude isn’t marked on the VFR chart.

dublinpilot wrote:

Just because FL55 isn’t available, doesn’t stop you busting it when the base of controlled airspace is defined as FL55.

Again, if you have not passed the transition altitude, then by definition you can’t be at FL55. So how can you possibly bust a level that you aren’t at? If the transition altitude is 4500’ and I am flying 4500’ at the by ATC provided QNH then I am at ALTITUDE 4500’. I can’t be at ALTITUDE 4500’ and at the same time at FL55, no matter the air pressure. Because, again, by the definition at or below the transition altitude, my height is expressed as altitude and not as flight levels. It’s right there in your AIP. Read it.

I mean this pretty basic altimeter rules stuff. Planes fly altitudes based on QNH and flight levels, NOT GPS altitudes. What sense would it make to define airspace boundaries based on something different? I really don’t understand how this can be such a difficult topic to grasp.

Peter wrote:

The two don’t differ much at typical UK GA altitudes i.e. SFC to 2000ft What atmospheric conditions would you need for say a 200ft error at 2000ft? (the UK CAA man will bust you for 200ft into CAS – plenty in the MOR summaries I get).

I though from discussions here that you’ll be busted being 1 ft into CAS… We’ve gone through this again and again and I’ve been led to understand that the CAA does not take altimeter error, mode C resolution or QNH roundoff into consideration? With 200 ft margin being applied, I don’t see what the problem is! Anyway…

Att 2000 ft, you’d need an air temperature of about -15°C, corresponding to a sea level temperature of about -11°C at standard lapse rate to get a 200 ft error. For 100 ft it is enough with -3°C air / +1°C sea level temperature. If we instead take 4500 ft as an example, it is enough with an air temperature of -6°C, corresponding to a sea level temperature of +3°C to get a 200 ft error.

Not sure if AA will do the calculation I asked

Sure I will. But as I wrote this is in the PPL syllabus and even more so in the IR syllabus as an IR pilot must be able to compute the minimum safe altitude taking actual temperature into account.