Peter wrote:
Of course Sweden is an amazing country; the best in the world.
I don’t think I’ve ever said anything like that. In fact – contrary to your frequent claim that no one criticises their own country – I have criticised it several times. Particularly, of course, as regards the Swedish CAA, considering the purpose of this forum, but also about Swedish Schengen “suspensions”. I think I have also recently rather strongly criticised our new government.
There were an interesting case here a few years ago.
Well, there you go. So Sweden is exactly the same as the UK… just as I would expect.
@Cobalt thank you that is interesting as useful. As I suspected, the requirement will be about double that which could be supported by an ordinary 3-phase supply to light commercial premises.
The subsidy scheme is useful but only if you are definitely going ahead with the project. You have to have the work done and then claim – and you might or might not be successful. Obviously the preference would be to put an application in and then make a decision when you know whether or not money is available. It is also capped at a certain % of the project cost, so for the situation I’m considering it doesn’t change the fact that it’s a very significant financial outlay that I will be trying to avoid the company getting involved with.
Peter wrote:
Well, there you go. So Sweden is exactly the same as the UK… just as I would expect.
Well, no. As there was no court decision, electricians still don’t have to care about the part of the installation that they don’t work on. (By legislation, the owner of the building is liable for the safety of the electrical installation.)
Cobalt wrote:
When I got my charger installed I was fretting about 3-phase and whatnot, turns out, all irrelevant.
This. I tried to get a subsidized charger. If you have one installed by a certified electician and have a green electricity provider, you could get 900€ in Germany. As the cheapest of these chargers were 450€ and I already had an 11kW plug in the garage, I thought 350€ for mounting the device on the wall and filling out a form should work.
Turns out the electricians only want to sell you the whole package for 1400€ minimum (“but it’s 900 € cheaper!”).
So, up yours, I’m using a simple single phase charging brick, it’s even switchable to 1400W so you don’t grill the Schuko plug (which isn’t rated for a continuous load of 2700W). And you know what? It’s completely sufficient for my purposes. Yes, charging the Zoe from 0 to 100% takes 27h, but I don’t do that. Whenever I get below 60% or so I charge it overnight.
But if one has a 100km commute on a daily basis… well, it still would work perfectly fine!
So, this whole charging issue is highly overrated and basically an extesion of the range anxiety.
Also, having a reliable electric installation is a basic requirement, when we brought the house there was still the original fabric-sheathed aluminium cable from 1936. Also a reliable plug is necessary, the German Schuko is very rugged by design, but be careful in other countries.
Some more things to consider: Charging with 1,4kW is less efficient than charging with 11kW, charging with 22kW is also harsh on the batteries.
Much depends on what you already have in your house.
Add up the appliances.
One thing which a lot of people have is an electric shower, and the “actually usable” ones are 10kW.
Then you have an oven and a hob in the kitchen.
3 phase may not be strictly needed (the UK is apparently unusual in that you can get 80-100A on 1ph) but it makes it a lot easier to distribute the load. And appliances with motors – a heat pump is a common case – work much better in their 3ph versions. Basically all “industrial grade” stuff is 3ph.
By ‘electric shower’ do you mean one that heats its own water from the cold feed?
I thought these were things of the past since the widespread adoption of combi boilers – massively oversized for the CH so that they can feed the HW demand of the shower and kitchen tap at the same time. My parents still have an electric-heated shower, and it’s crap – awful flow rate. I have a modern Aqualisa shower which is great – two of them actually – I just looked on the pump box and it says 250W. Hot water from a big tank which is heated by the Aga and also an immersion heater.
It does all add up, but I reckon the average UK domestic installation can afford another 32amp circuit? Especially if most use will be at night.
do you mean one that heats its own water from the cold feed?
Yes.
The early ones were ~3kW and were crap, as you say.
I thought these were things of the past since the widespread adoption of combi boilers
I don’t think so, though I don’t know the %. Combi boilers have a very low flow rate – takes for ever to fill a bath 
They also generally have less than stellar temperature control. And they work only with gas (not oil, and electric ones would draw 20kW plus).
Hot water from a big tank which is heated by the Aga and also an immersion heater.
That is common, though normally it is heated by a coil fed by the central heating boiler (via a zone valve). Much more efficient than an Aga, and much cheaper than an immersion heater especially if the heating is running anyway.
Especially if most use will be at night.
Then, sure.
Peter wrote:
And they work only with gas (not oil, and electric ones would draw 20kW plus).
Actually my parents have an oil combi boiler. But also still the crappy electric shower, go figure….
Peter wrote:
That is common, though normally it is heated by a coil fed by the central heating boiler (via a zone valve). Much more efficient than an Aga, and much cheaper than an immersion heater especially if the heating is running anyway.
Yes normally. However the previous owners put an Aga in – burning LPG – and I like it. Always a warm kitchen (no radiator in there obviously) and no electricity required for cooking. Right now LPG is looking cheap compared to electricity and even mains gas.
At the moment it has got fairly cold so the CH is on a bit too, but in certain weather (say 8-12 degrees OAT) the Aga is enough – the constant low heat permeates right through the house and augmented with the wood burner in the evenings (and walls 2ft thick solid stone) you just don’t need the CH.
Peter wrote:
Yet these people are in a far better position than most city inhabitants.
Not necessarily: a huge number of city inhabitants can get rid of the car altogether (and save a lot of money in the process).
Even in my semi-rural area, if I didn’t need to go to Andreas airfield, I could get rid of my car, it’s really the only use case it has left – quite often I can go a fortnight without driving – because all our daily needs are met by things within walking distance, and occasional needs are met with a bicycle+trailer. City dwellers often can do everything without a car.
