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Russian invasion of Ukraine

We have some special rules for this thread, in addition to the normal EuroGA Guidelines. The basic one is that EuroGA will not be a platform for pro Russian material. For that, there are many sites on the internet. No anti Western posts. Most of us live in the "West" and enjoy the democratic and material benefits. Non-complying posts will be deleted and, if the poster is a new arrival, he will be banned.

This is quite funny:

So now Putin is going to arrest what’s left of his smart people

Shooting down low flying jets and “slow” missiles has been a solved issue for many years (systems like IRIS, Nasams, etc, and all the other Europe-developed stuff, do it OK) and the Patriot system has been developed in the last 20 years to do this, so nobody should be surprised that finally it works as per the label on the box.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

It’s funny that in “the west” when something major goes wrong, we don’t tend to blame the individual or civil service. Instead we tend to call the minister to account as they were ultimately responsible for the project and its supervision. As the phrase goes, “the buck stops at their desk”. (Sometimes unfairly). Blame seems to rise up through a government while those at the top try desperately to put a lid on it.

In Russia blame seems to flow downwards. The President, ministers or heads of bodies often seem to be truly to blame, but they find someone low down and blame them for something, charge them and imprison them and the blame rests there, having flowed downwards from the top!

EIWT Weston, Ireland

Good tsar bad boyars.

“it’s funny that in “the west” when something major goes wrong, we don’t tend to blame the individual or civil service. Instead we tend to call the minister to account”

Maybe in the West – Eire. My experience is that the UK is far enough East for blame to pass to the lowest possible level.

Maoraigh
EGPE, United Kingdom

It’s hard to do that because the victim will just sue for unfair dismissal, and blow the story to the newspapers. And adding a sexual harrassment angle guarantees lots of coverage.

In this case a part of the story seems to be that one of the designers had a family member living abroad, so…

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

This is resurrected & spiced-up old story https://www.jurist.org/news/2022/08/scientist-in-russia-hypersonic-missile-program-jailed-accused-of-treason/

Happily lapped-up by the echo chambers in the West.

Frankly, I don’t see the point of such psy-ops, its preaching to the choir anyway.

Slovakia

Different and older story.

Indeed, EuroGA is in the west, and the policy has to be to support Ukraine against Russia’s illegal invasion. Otherwise we are all buggered.

Those who want the Russian view can probably get an app from TASS – the fount of all truth and knowledge

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter wrote:

Different and older story.

In what sense it is different? The scientists are the same.

The new part I see in that excerpt is ‘earlier this week, Ukraine said it had managed to destroy six of the weapons in a single night – a claim Russia has disputed’.
A but more balanced ‘news’ would have added ‘Russia said it had managed to destroy Patriot missile system – a claim that Ukraine has disputed (but USA confirmed).’

Peter wrote:

the policy has to be to support Ukraine against Russia’s illegal invasion.

So are we living in a post-truth society where the purpose of a news piece is more important than its truth?

I am a bit too old fashioned for that, sorry.

Last Edited by esteban at 18 May 07:30
Slovakia

The internet is big and there are plenty of pro-Russian debating groups. They are all over Twatter and all over Telegram, for example. In fact all social media platforms are full of Russians and pro-Russians; they are all pretty busy.

In fact they are busy everywhere else too; russian and chinese hacking is big on our server (and everybody else’s server) and now russian and chinese IPs are firewall-blocked here. I might add India at some point; only yesterday got 5 spammer signups from there.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter, all I am saying is:

How can you effectively help Ukraine if you don’t want to know the truth and prefer to view the situation in rose-coloured glasses?

If you reject all inconvenient claims as Russian/Chinese/Indian propaganda?

Don’t you think you are falling into the same trap as communists telling people ’Don’t listen to Voice of America/Radio Free Europe/…, its all subversive imperialistic propaganda.’?

I am not saying you should take information from non-western sources as a gospel, all I am saying is that you should be aware of the manipulation by the mainstream western media and if you want to know what is really going on, you need to widen your sources and apply critical analysis to ALL of them, including the pro-ukrainian ones.

If you consider this pro-Russian stance, then I really don’t know how to help you.

Slovakia
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