At 9:00 here
is @williamF stating what some believed but this is the first time I’ve heard someone who actually knows the business say it.
Those 50k loans were dished out everywhere and were widely abused, with an amazing % going to literally nonexistent businesses, and the govt has decided to not bother recovering a lot of them 
For sure. The average PPL has much less than £50k (€58k euro) of capital tied up in aircraft ownership. There has been a constant push towards group ownership and hiring. I can think of many people in groups/hiring who could easily afford a six-figure aircraft but don’t make the jump to sole ownership. As an aside – I’ve always promoted the just-one-partner approach and 50/50 group ownership, which can work really well.
Drawing down one of the famed UK bounce-back loans was just an admin exercise, and if you had multiple businesses you could have taken multiple loans. The UK aircraft market below 200k is totally separate from the rest of the world. Since Brexit, very few UK-based end users will import an aircraft with the VAT/Change of Registry complications. This underpins the value of aeroplanes in the UK because the importation option is not taken by the average PPL bod.
The hardest aeroplanes to buy are low-value aeroplanes. I went to look at one on Friday and told the guy I’m not trying to haggle the price I just can’t afford to fix a 20k aeroplane anymore, so it’s not for me. The other thing I firmly believe in, is that older aeroplanes/cars/boats are the most speculative area now. You can get great value and utility from this area of the market if you are a knowledgeable end user. If someone came up to me and offered me a 75k Tiger Moth for 30k, I would keep my 30k. There are plenty of low-value aeroplanes that didn’t see big price increases, and their value is hovering around 2003 levels still.
When we do see an adjustment in prices the first ones to fall won’t actually be the sub £50k ones. It will be the SR22.
Peter wrote:
Those 50k loans were dished out everywhere and were widely abused, with an amazing % going to literally nonexistent businesses, and the govt has decided to not bother recovering a lot of them
It is theft. Plain and simple. They were all at it. Politicians, charities, Limited companies, Baronesses, you name it.
Not much news about it due it to being another major scandal and thorough incompetence on behalf of our Masters.
However attempt to overclaim on your Universal Credit by ten quid and you will have the bailiffs at your door, trying to take what you don’t have.
I truly despair at times..
There are some classics done at high level but they don’t get away with it
I agree 100% with the abandonment of the 50k loans and then HMRC chasing you for years for £100.
I just think it is hilarious how many people are stupid enough to get 50k especially as a loan and buying a plane for 50k There is a really useless English saying which seems really appropriate here. A later version, which by its crudity I would associate with the former USSR area, but it apparently isn’t, is this.
There has been a constant push towards group ownership and hiring. I can think of many people in groups/hiring who could easily afford a six-figure aircraft but don’t make the jump to sole ownership
IMHO, syndicates are popular because many/most people in GA are looking for maximum reward coupled with minimum responsibility, and in a syndicate you wangle some poor bastard to look after the plane, the insurance, etc, while you turn up every few weeks to fly it. It’s almost as good as renting 
Ownership is quite a learning curve.
There are plenty of low-value aeroplanes that didn’t see big price increases, and their value is hovering around 2003 levels still.
Absolutely and it amazes me how much value you can find if you are in a position to absorb a 10K or 20K or whatever maintenance hit after buying such a plane. It’s that necessity and fear that holds the market prices down, but if you buy wisely that hit never comes. IME you instead fly on in your 35K plane for a long time. I’m up to 13 years in mine, my major cost of ownership has been storage and I have little interest in changing planes.
Well managed risk = Economic reward.
Silvaire wrote:
Absolutely and it amazes me how much value you can find if you are in a position to absorb a 10K or 20K or whatever maintenance hit after buying such a plane
I think most certified aircraft in that price range here in UK will be pretty knackered/corroded and begging for a full rebuild. There are some exceptions but that price range is definitely the dregs of the UK certified market.
Plenty of nice permit aeroplanes for that price, BUT they are an ongoing and never ending project.
In the good old days, before covid made everybody go mad and mountain bikes went from 2k to 5k, etc, you could have bought an “airworthy, sort of, between now and the Annual, anyway” TB20 for <50k
But yes it would be a well shagged, ~1984 one. Somebody asked me about one and I said it will cost you another 100k. He bought it anyway and … wait for it … spent 100k on it I suspect someone who got the 50k loan for a plane (i.e. with no intention of ever paying it back) might well have been in that category.
All aircraft are an ongoing and never-ending project. The only difference is whether the project is costing you hundreds, thousands or tens of thousands. You can spend as much as you want to spend to buy and set up a plane, and however much you spend you are likely to say that you couldn’t possibly have spent less no matter what you did.
In the case of my first plane, a $22K Luscombe that had recently before won best of show and people’s choice at the US national type fly-in, it may actually have been impossible to spend less to get a nice plane that people admired It was as simple as could be and had been in a million pieces, each of which was restored within the last 5 years. It couldn’t cost much to run unless you crashed it… which unfortunately the buyer from me 17 years later did within a week of ownership. That’s surely one thing to avoid!
Taking into account the money regained by selling plane #1, buying two planes has cost me $37K out of pocket so far and plane #2 had under 1000 hrs total time when purchased. If you have an eye for a bargain, armed with some level of knowledge, I think a bargain for 50K or less can be found, anywhere. You may have to step outside the mainstream. The secret is that most buyers are risk averse, haven’t gathered much knowledge to mitigate risk, and aren’t willing to make the effort to meet experienced and friendly people who can help them as a buyer and a new owner of a given type. They are stuck in a retail herd mentality.
Obviously 50K is not a lot of money in the scheme of running one’s life, and spending that much or less on a plane is the way I like it. My priority in using my money is growth, planes are just for fun and they’re more fun for me when they don’t distract me from doing something more productive with my resources. Obviously there is no way on God’s earth I’d borrow money to buy a plane.
PS Here’s one that might be bought for 50K or little more.
