A TB20 pays about €10k/year in property tax, in Greece. But only if SX-reg.
And I can completely understand why no A&P/IA wants to spend a few days in a beautiful country, with friendly people, the best food there is, just to do some work on a plane! 
Obviously there is a business opportunity. I know one IA who used to do this but he lost his “IA”.
A small point: how do people deal with being unable to return the passenger on the planned day?
Same issue, different question: How do you deal with the fact that YOU have to be back or face dismissal or at least severe reprecussions at work?
Basically all employees face this threat today, where most companies are looking for reasons to reduce their workforce, but particularly people who are employed in shift services and need a damn good reason to miss a work day. And flying GA is not one of them for most bosses but rather is flying GA a reason to keep an eye on that worker from the outset. After all how can he afford to fly these “extremely expensive” toys with the money they pay him?
The answer is very discouraging: You need to plan 2-3 buffer days for each trip where there is the shadow of a doubt that you will return back on time, which reduces your already small vaccation allowance by up to 30% or you need to fly only to destinations where you have a bullet proof 2nd option to get back and be there on time.
The same thing applies more or less for the trip outbound: Most people with their very limited time have no flexibility in their working times, that is they want to depart on THE DAY their vaccation starts and return on the last day so as not to miss valuable vaccation time sitting around waiting for the weather to clear. Fail to do that and people will never consider flying with you again.
Passengers with this issue? I agree, don’t carry them in the first place.
Nearly all men in straight jobs are working 110% of their waking hours.
And with schedules set in stone.
Interestingly, GA is not the only thing managers look at wearily. I know some folk whose boss strongly discourages them from skiing e.t.c. by hinting that if they break a leg or so in this “dangerous and unnecessary” sport, by the time they come back they will be replaced by someone else. Even though that is illegal, many people are sufficiently scared to loose their job to comply.
The very majority of people are not that important such that they absolutely can’t miss a day at work at short notice. It happens all that time due to illness.
Illness is a different thing, you can get a doctor’s certificate for that (as we need to every time). But not to appear at work because you are stranded? No way. I know of cases where even people whose airline flight was delayed or cancelled had to provide proof in order not to be sacked or punished at work. I usually even with the airlines take one day reserve on my trips to cover this possibility…
Basically the people who can use GA the most are either self employed or retired. Which reflects strongly on the pilot population.
None of the original 1 through 11 apply to me. Some of them obivously also don’t apply to renters, generally.
10.lack of support from OH (other half)
I’dd like to add 10b: lack of OH. Seriously – if you have an OH that enjoys going on trips regularly, that must be like heaven for a private pilot. I’m working on that. I have a lot of friends who like to go on trips (some shorter, some longer), but I suppose it’s just not the same both in terms of quality and “personal dispatch rate” as going on a trip with your enthusiastic girlfriend (or family member in general) whenever you see fit (spontaneously…). “Friends” tend to have other plans already by the time you propose a trip to them.
9.lack of nice people to do trips with
That’s the one thing you can most easily influence though. You may need to think outside of the box if your school and club doesn’t “provide” the people you need and want, but the world is full of nice people to do trips with…
Additionally I’m under 30 years old and can’t find anyone close to my age.
Well, here’s one. And I don’d mind hostels at all…
I’ve been lucky in the sense that I kept in touch with some of the students I learned with (it helped that we also lived on the same compound during the five weeks of training) and although we met in California, some of them live quite close to me. We`ve been meeting up for trips occasionally.
And btw., there’s hope… as we grow older ourselves! With my other hobby, it¨s more frustrating: I have the feeling I’m getting too old for it…
But I can imagine you’d like to meet younger pilots, and most of those seem indeed to be spoiled by comfort.
Interesting! So is it the young ones who are staying in tents and hostels and the older ones preferring their fair share of luxury (because they can… afford it) or is it the older ones enjoying the romantic appeal of camping and the young and spoiled rich ones not doing anything less than ****-hotels? Or really, is it neither and it’s nothing to do with age and rather with personality and lifestyle? 
A small point: how do people deal with being unable to return the passenger on the planned day?
QuoteI think many people exagerate about this.[…] These are more excuses for not going than real reasons why one cannot go.
I find this a big turn-off for people realizing they may not get back in time for whatever they are up to next and it certainly reduces the amount of trips with people actually done vs. the amount of trips that would have been done with a more sensible (by any objective measure) dispatch rate. For myself, it COULD turn into a problem at work esp. when customers are involved, but I’d deal with it.
For my next trip, I laid out the option to fly back with me for anyone of my friends I meet down in Italy, but I encouraged everyone to book a return airline trip anyway to be on the safe side (not much more expensive than a one-way ticket for them anyway).
Doesnt fancy in new generation. Reasons ?
-Unbelievable taxation,social envy,EASAs friendly burdens,CAA bureaucracy and innefficiency,minimal working hours in aerodromes,
unfriendly NOTAMs,lack of fuel in aerodromes,Cessna SIDs and last but not least…a lack of morale.
There is a lack of new PPL entrants but I don’t think any of the potential candidates dive into the topic enough to even understand what EASA, NOTAMs and SIDs are. I think it’s a more complete loss of interest for flying in favor of other activities and the options for leisure activities are pretty abundant these days…
in terms of quality and “personal dispatch rate” as going on a trip with your enthusiastic girlfriend
Yes – the absolutely best thing (for a boy pilot) is to have a girl who likes flying
But usually that means not having one initially and choosing one after you start flying
I did pretty well with Justine, who took 10 years to decide she won’t do the longer trips anymore. She will still do say 2hrs but only if I buy a return airline ticket, which is OK.
There is an additional point I should have put in my original post: Most people have a full diary and can’t do trips at a short notice.
In fact I sense that a lot of people feel “socially inadequate” if their diary has gaps in it. In the days of filofaxes I knew a number who had a 2cm thick filofax for their social life. I know a few old friends who book a beer with me (in a pub) 1 month ahead. Whereas I don’t like booking anything at all because that one beer on say a Wednesday night rules out the whole week for doing a trip somewhere.
I did pretty well with Justine, who took 10 years to decide she won’t do the longer trips anymore. She will still do say 2hrs but only if I buy a return airline ticket, which is OK.
Which is a sad datapoint showing that GA just has very low utility value. It’s for enthusiasts but if that component is missing, there are almost no rationale arguments for it. It was very different before the big Easyjet etc. revolution. You could conveniently go to places that you couldn’t reach otherwise and it was even often cheaper than an airline. Nowadays you have think very hard to find such trips that make sense. If you live in a rural place that happens to have a good airport, then it can be useful but in the metropolitan areas it hardly ever makes sense.
I should clarify – the return ticket is in case of suspect wx on the way back, not because she won’t do the return flight. And I prefer it that way because it takes the pressure off me, enabling me to make the decision purely on technical wx data. The Prague fly-in (~4-5hrs each way) she will do entirely by airline.
Which is a sad datapoint showing that GA just has very low utility value.
I have been to exactly 3 places where the plane definitely added value in terms of the time/cost balance:
One could argue that the ease of reaching Le Touqet (record is 1:05 from leaving home to getting on a bike at LFAT) makes up for the cost, but I’m not sure Le Touqet is special enough that I wouldn’t go if it wasn’t the easiest trip possible.
Or really, is it neither and it’s nothing to do with age and rather with personality and lifestyle?
Or even more simply, who you are travelling with, what is available, and what sort of mood you are in? I am quite happy camping and and youth hostels, but also enjoy a comfortable hotel and nice dinners with fine wines… By far the biggest factor in this is who I am travelling with.
Nearly all men in straight jobs are working 110% of their waking hours.
I know some folk whose boss strongly discourages them from skiing e.t.c. by hinting that if they break a leg or so in this “dangerous and unnecessary” sport, by the time they come back they will be replaced by someone else.
But, really? I don’t perceive the working world to be like this. I suppose it’s a function of the market. If you are easily replacable (AND you are unlucky enough to work in a company with mean people like that? Is that the norm?), I could maybe see this.
Slightly tongue-in-cheek, but if my boss would seriously try to discourage me from going skiing on these grounds, I would replace my boss (and company) rather than wait for them to replace me after the trip. But it would simply never happen because the company I work for (and the companies MOST people I know work for) simply don’t maintain a culture that would allow managers to act like this. In fact, we have team skiing events every now and then. Unfortunately, no team flying events so far.
Or even more simply, who you are travelling with, what is available, and what sort of mood you are in? I am quite happy camping and and youth hostels, but also enjoy a comfortable hotel and nice dinners with fine wines… By far the biggest factor in this is who I am travelling with.
100% agreed.
I have a girlfriend who loves to join me flying. I realize that it takes only one or two negative experiences for her to give up, so I try very hard to make the ride as smooth as possible.
First of all: It’s my hobby and while she likes it, she will never be as passionate about it as I am.
So I don’t bother her with all the details. I do the flight planning in advance and pick an interesting destination where the weather is nice.
I don’t check WX on my mobile phone while we are away at a restaurant. In fact I check it only just before flight, because I can’t change it anyway. With the DA40 and the ADL120 (which allows me to tactically route around weather), I can fly virtually every day during summer time.
Usually we do flights from around 2-3 hours. Lot of nice places to visit in that radius.
The longest leg so far was Lelystad – Venice last year. It took 4 hours, but since the scenery is changing so rapidly, one doesn’t have the time to get bored…
I fly always IFR because VFR comes with a lot more uncertainty which can cause stress. It’s less comfortable too.
There’s a psychological aspect which seem to work in my advantage: Most of my flying is done with other pilots / friends. This triggers my girlfriend: Hey, when are we going on a trip again? I think if I would do all my flights with her, she wouldn’t bother anymore… ;-)
This triggers my girlfriend: Hey, when are we going on a trip again? I think if I would do all my flights with her, she wouldn’t bother anymore… ;-)
Have you tried flying with other women and see what that does?
