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Lithium fire - what would you do?

Yes they had two field investigation this month both 20 pages each one a B737 losing gear and one is glider battery
It seems they are on the topic, especially FES is getting more popular in gliders or in general as electric technology in unregulated types

Paris/Essex, France/UK, United Kingdom

An “aquaeous dispersion” implies dihydrogen monoxide, which is known to have cooling and fire extinguishing properties. Perhaps that is the active ingredient.

Maoraigh
EGPE, United Kingdom

This was at my old field but yes FES is very popular as you’ll see at Aero next year.

Jets are becoming more prevalent too as they are fairly simple in operation and light too.

I’m glad no-one was Injured but also hope that incidents like these won’t stop development of electric aircraft. (I currently own a PHEV and love driving it!)

I wonder if it is possible to have a fire suppression system which would cope with the battery compartment fire.

I know avgas likes to burn really well too but it doesn’t spontaneously ignite inside a fuel tank, and in general would not ignite there even if a spark was introduced because there is not enough oxygen available.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter wrote:

I wonder if it is possible to have a fire suppression system which would cope with the battery compartment fire.

For aircraft of our class and size, solutions should probably be sought in the car racing community: example example example.

On the other hand, if you are talking of lithium starter batteries for fossil fuel engines, the most suitable chemistry for this purpose is LiFePO4, which is about as safe as lead/acid (not susceptible to thermal runaway).

LKBU (near Prague), Czech Republic

Peter wrote:

I wonder if it is possible to have a fire suppression system which would cope with the battery compartment fire.

Ibra might correct me but I think “dealing” with a fire would be one of the roles of the parachute.

Titanium battery box, insulated with exhaust pipes?

Other

Noe wrote:

Ibra might correct me but I think “dealing” with a fire would be one of the roles of the parachute.

You mean the pilot parachute not the ballistic parachute recovery system attached to the glider (something similar to Cirrus CAPS is fitted to some popular new FES gliders: http://www.alisport.com/?product=silent-2-electro-2)?

Not sure if pulling the glider parachute will eject the battery, unless trained to parachute into the wild by firefighter departments I will not bet on it

The only advantages that glider pilot have are air-breaks and fire sitting in the back: he may initiate a quick emergency decent but structural failure will come very soon on fiberglass/wood than aeroplanes metals, still structural failures in gliders can be mitigated by pilot parachute (often prescribed for mid-air collisions with other gliders in thermals, clouds or from stress in aerobatics)

I think using different chemistry for batteries as LiFePo4 or solid-state electrolytes as Ultranomad mentioned will help, or just leave battery charging and operation usage to some internal monitoring/warning system as in new cars (the next FADEC electric engine ?)

Paris/Essex, France/UK, United Kingdom

LiFePo4 won’t happen because of the much lower capacity. This would take the advance in electric propulsion back 10-20 years. That the advance has been made with batteries which might readily ignite is a separate discussion

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Yes, LiFePo4 have been used in saistainers but not in self-launched due to limited capacity/endurance…

For electric self-launch, they just have to introduce a combined EFATO+BFATO: Engine Failure & Battery Fire after take-off

I don’t see this coming on approach: usual practice is engine off (e.g. noise complains, human error: either a glider or power) or in sustained S&L flight as you only need 4kW versus 20 kW for take-off, however, you may still have issues from flying with a battery with internal damage or bad production QA batch (another FES accident happened as battery was dropped on the ground but pilot judge it undamaged externally but may had been impacted internally)

Paris/Essex, France/UK, United Kingdom
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