To make a forum work well one needs to do a lot more than just make it free, however. One also has to put some effort into moderating it, and that makes you some enemies… who keep coming back and creating continuous work. But before that, it needs to be set up in the right way.
Anyway, coming back to the start of this, I hope Timothy posts the results of his survey here on EuroGA and not just in some closed forum (which very few people visit, but that isn’t the point) 
Timothy wrote:
One of those is the forum, but when I am “selling” PPL/IR membership, it is a long way down the list of why people should pay.Indeed. Timothy sold the PPL/IR membership to me in 2015 in Friedrichshafen and it certainly was not for the forum. Also, I don’t have any feeling that I’ve contributed less to EuroGA since becoming a PPL/IR member.
Peter wrote:
But the case for a paid forum is much more difficult to make.
Although I joined PPL/IR – and continue to do so – primarily in order to support its valiant work that it does on behalf of its members; the bonus of its forum has great value and, for me, is an added bonus which I appreciate.
Its value is, I believe, enhanced precisely because it IS private.
This means that one’s contributions are taken seriously (by other serious minded members) – and if one inadvertently states something that is not completely accurate and/or needs correction – this is done with generosity and fairness; rather than the ‘slagging off’ that sometimes occurs on other systems.
It also allows the contributors to be more ‘open’ in expressing their opinions e.g. being frank about a particular airfield etc. (The ‘Airfield Notes’ are, in my opinion one of the great asset forum pages of PPL/IR) without the ‘counterclaims’ that come back on other sites.
I belong to other ‘closed’ forums where, in a professional capacity, one can express/share/explore areas which one would be reluctant to do so on a ‘public’ page.
I believe in assessing private v. public forums, it is not an ‘either/or’ but rather a ‘both/and’.
Each has its role and place.
Unlike Timothy, I DO rate highly the PPL/IR forum as one of the added bonuses of being a member; and have proselytised others to join PPL/IR for that very reason: Even, though, it was not – nor is now – the main reason for belonging to such a good organisation.
Yes, but isnt that more a justification for private, which isnt necessarily the same thing as private and paid?
I believe, enhanced precisely because it IS private.
It’s nowhere near private, Peter. Anybody can pay up and join and read past posts all the way back. It’s a fallacy… They also have a big turnover because every year many drop out so new people have to be continually recruited.
And it’s happened, with threats of legal action by one “famous” personality. The forum changed a great deal after that.
That’s why I think a forum which requires a payment to read the stuff adds no value and merely perverts the reasons people might have for disseminating useful info. People naturally think that because they are paying, they are getting something special; moreover they are discouraged from disseminating that info outside, even though it is obvious it would help many more people. It becomes a little “club”, and some members feel ashamed to participate outside it.
There is only one way to run a relatively private forum: have only personally invited members, and a “black ball” system (whereby any existing member’s objection blocks the newcomer). Then it is difficult for “well known nasty” people, or CAA employees, etc, to get in. Such a site was set up by a splinter group from the socata.org type specific site, about 10 years ago, after moderation got totally out of hand when four mods were appointed and the lowest common denominator (and extreme political correctness) ruled. I was invited and was there for about a year. I left because it gradually ceased to have aviation content (it was alleged that a a deal was done with the owner of socata.org, to keep aviation related material to socata.org, which is probably accurate in retrospect) and it filled up with porn and other silly stuff. It only ever had about 50 people, IIRC, and that is the big problem with trying to achieve some level of privacy. The PPL/IR forum (I have no wish to bring them up but others do) only had about 40.
Payment is no substitute for proper moderation. There were a few really nasty people inside PPL/IR and the mod at the time let them roam freely, even allowing one to post a personal email. It’s down to the mod to run a transparent mod policy and be accountable for major cockups. Nobody is perfect but I would be lynched if I did that here.
Peter wrote:
The PPL/IR forum (I have no wish to bring them up but others do) only had about 40.
The statistics on that forum site suggests the number of active users is several times that. But of course it depends on what you include in that number.
If you have a forum which shows the number of clicks on a thread, and it has say 50 regular readers, you tend to find that after the initial post you get 50 clicks. When somebody replies, the total goes to 100. After the next reply it goes to 150, and so on. It’s because “everybody” comes back to read the new post.
On EuroGA there are other ways to narrow down what one has to read, so if we had a click count it would not always follow that. And if one had say the old RSS, one would see fewer clicks because some people will be reading it via the RSS.
I hope Timothy posts the results of his survey here on EuroGA
So do I, but don’t see that he’s under any obligation, moral or otherwise, to do so.
EuroGA is a free resource (in the sense that it’s not immediately obvious how I’m paying for it, like Wikileaks and the GFS) and if some diligent geezer is willing and able to take such “free” data and add value to the extent that someone else is willing to pay for it more or less directly… well, that’s what “makes the world go round”.
Both seem to work fairly well, with contributors members of both making great contributions on both forums.
If it ain’t broken, don’t fix it
I thnk the whole premise behind the thread’s question is silly. “Should flying forums be free?”
On what basis? If a private paid members organisation wants to have a forum, they can. If Peter wants to have a free flying forum, he can.
