PowerFLARM Fusion - anyone using it?

I am not quite sure what it is about all the details in this thread. We got a Trig TT 21 S-transponder that gets positions from an uncertified GPS mouse for ADS-B OUT plus IN of course, using the Pilotaware Rosetta. I have set SIL-0 on the Trig, wonder what would happen if I set it for SIL-1 ??? Would anybody care and how would they know ?? Anyway, the Pilotaware Rosetta feeds the EasyVFR tablet via WIFI and a wire goes to the Trig for sending ADS-B OUT. We can see Flarm warnings occasinally and a lot of ADS-B traffic with acoustic warnings as well from the tablet speaker, no connection into headsets yet, don´t care. In my photo below – with poor forums pictures resolutions – there are aircraft shown by altitude, speed , positions and registrations. All our flights can be seen at common fight tracking sites with speeds, altitudes, registration, aircraft type and all, from takeoff to landing. Yeah, privacy concerns – nobody having his smartphone on 24 hours all year is qualified to whine about privacy I say, he can be tracked all the time. The blue aircraft is own ship, with line in 10 miles sections in front. So the range is more than 50 miles on the tablet. You can set vertical warnings, I did 1000 feet separation for warnings when a conflicting aircraft with less will turn red for alerts. So I don´t see much use for TCAS in typical GA (will never happen) , you don´t get positions from this, just altitude alerts and you are supposed to change flight levels for avoidance, same like with S transponder warnings and no ADS-B OUT , with only exact altitude transmitted. We get position warnings on the Trig display in times, no lat/long numbers shown then, so I tick them away when found. Not sure if ADS-B is stopped for long in this condition, the tracking sites don´t display interruptions in the flights. Anyway, ADS-B is just a little bit of extra safety in flight, no real 100 percent solution for traffic avoidance as long as there will be flying objects around without it. No, it will not help having exclusive faith in looking out the windows, lots of situations when this will not help at all. Vic

Quote
SafeSky uses the same principle as PilotAware – getting the traffic info from the ground. Although PAW does it slightly better as the reception of their ground signal is better at altitude.

This is incorrect.

Pilot aware detects most things directly, and ‘live’
There are significant enhancements when in reach of a ground station. However the lates version means you only need to be in range of another PAW aircraft that can ’relay’a ground station to you that you may be not in range of.

I’m only interested in the main feature set but the other stuff is very useful.

Peter wrote:

You can’t radiate an “uncertified” ABS-B OUT signal (SIL=0) via a Mode S TXP.

I think you can, if your GPS source is uncertified.

Peter wrote:

You can’t radiate an “uncertified” ABS-B OUT signal (SIL=0) via a Mode S TXP.

This is nothing to do with Powerflarm however.

@Peter

I am not sure you´re correct about the part “..You can´t radiate..”.
The way I read Trigs FAQ answer is that you can indeed use a non certified (FLARM GPS) to “radiate” ADS-B-out (as SIL=0) in their mentioned Mode S transponders.

See Trig (OEM) statement about using FLARM GPS:

https://www.trig-avionics.com/support/support-faqs/ads-b-faqs/

“Can I use my FLARM GPS as a position source?
Yes, as long as you are not trying to meet any regulatory requirements. Most FLARM devices output GPS data using the NMEA protocol which is compatible with Trig transponders.
All Trig transponders look for $GPRMC NMEA messages.
Note – this GPS source gives you SIL = 0 , which is ignored by certain ADS-B In traffic receivers. Additionally, for US customers, SIL = 0 does not qualify you for either a traffic or weather uplink.
Trig recommends the use of the TN72 or TN70 which are visible to all ADS-B In traffic systems.”

Xtophe wrote:

Xtophe28-Oct-23 14:1552
Yeager wrote:
Are any of the available Traffic Collision Warning systems (such as PowerFlarm Fusion etc.) able to connect to the Trig TT31 (ADS-B out capable) Transponder and be used as the GPS source (SIL 0 or SIL 1+) for the Transponder?
The various “Flarm” boxes output the typical GPS NMEA messages on their output in addition to the traffic ones. The Trig transponder accept NMEA as GPS input. That will be SIL=0.

See e.g. here.

You can’t radiate an “uncertified” ABS-B OUT signal (SIL=0) via a Mode S TXP.

This is nothing to do with Powerflarm however.

See also “Threads possibly related to this one” below, especially this one.

I get quite cynical about a lot of this stuff. It’s been marketed at people who don’t know the limitations and who think they buy Box X and

• they can see everyone
• everyone can see them
• the CAA can’t see them (for pilot busting purposes)

The business models are mostly bogus too, relying on hardware sales forever supporting data re-transmission facilities, and on people not realising that at any realistic altitude they won’t get the signal anyway.

In reality, straight old Mode C (or Mode C/S) has the highest penetration in the population, but no cheap box shows azimuth on these (with the demise of Zaon).

Yeager wrote:

Yeager28-Oct-23 19:5557
Peter wrote:
Peter28-Oct-23 19:2856
Sadly that is not correct. I think I posted this further back.
Not that it matters much, but I looked back and don´t find any on this.
“Sadly that is not correct.” – Are you referring to commonly used installations in GA aircrafts (such as Garmin etc.) not allowing the operator to display SIL=0 aircraft?

@Peter, yeah I see you´ve had your fair share of ADB concerns back in 1018-19, in another thread.

It is indeed ridiculous, if in fact there are rather simple, but well avionics equipped, aircrafts flying around without having SIL=0 traffic displayed.
In Europe I don´t see the financial incentive to install a certified GPS receiver and GPS antenna, just so that airplanes, with system capabilities of displaying ADS-B SIL=0, that have selected to NOT display these, can “see me”.
Flying VFR on a modest, but certified, aircraft there are other tools and toys I´d want to install or upgrade. A certified GPS installation (to get SIL=3) adds “no value” for my VFR (only) certified airplane – SkyDemon give me the best possible data I need for VFR navigation (in addition to my always up-to-date paper chart 20kg bag (NOT)). I´ll provide SIL=0 via a mode S transponder but that´s about as much as give.

SafeSky uses the same principle as PilotAware – getting the traffic info from the ground. Although PAW does it slightly better as the reception of their ground signal is better at altitude.

Off topic I know but:-
Since making a move towards the ultralight side of ga I have found myself being introduced to several technologies I either didn’t know anything about or simply ignored as (and I am ashamed to say this) just being for the ULM scene.
The latest thing I’ve been introduced to is SafeSky TAS.
I can view traffic on my tablet in a split screen alongside Skydemon or SDVFR and I can also get audio warnings of traffic.
You need a smartphone or at least simcard which connects to ground stations and you see the same traffic as ATS sees.
The smartphone also acts as a sort of transponder (maybe not quite accurate but then I do know that all bicycles in the Tour de France are fitted with transponders and the teams can monitor their riders in a similar manner to SafeSky).
Yes you do need to be able to get a mobile connection to the ground station, but the claim is that 80% of Europe now have a connection up to 5000ft (I cannot verify this its SkySafe blurb).
They also claim that by 2025 they will also be connected to a satellite service so the coverage will be a lot greater and to all normal GA flight levels.
French ,ULM and free are synonymous, although this is Belgian free software.
I wonder if owners in the ULM world in Europe will be prepared to spend a great deal of money fitting costly TAS systems when you can get this free with the promise of greater things to come.
Maybe we could also get live onboard weather this way.🙂

Peter wrote:

Peter28-Oct-23 19:2856
Sadly that is not correct. I think I posted this further back.

Not that it matters much, but I looked back and don´t find any on this.
“Sadly that is not correct.” – Are you referring to commonly used installations in GA aircrafts (such as Garmin etc.) not allowing the operator to display SIL=0 aircraft?

Sadly that is not correct. I think I posted this further back.