Guillaume wrote:
There is an exemption going until 08/11/2018 so that one can fly those RNAV 1 procedure without being fully RNAV 1 compliant.
In order to fly those RNAV 1 procedure without being RNAV 1 compliant, you must have:
In particular this mean that you can use any RNAV 1 capable GPS unit even if it the installation isn’t RNAV 1 approved.
A completely dumb question: Where do you find what the installation is approved for in a rented plane? I know where to find what kind of approaches are allowed (LNAV/VNAV/LPV) but don’t remember seeing anywhere the RNAV capabilities.
That’s great! When is it planned to come into force?
Coincident with Part-NCO in Aug 2016
How does it relate to pilot training requirements?
There are a set of amendments to the Aircrew Regulation passed in a related package. Effective Aug 2018. I think we’ve discussed these in another thread. I don’t seem to be able to attach PDFs.
Walter wrote:
all (I think) GA aircrafts <2to MTOW, are not equipped with an fms, which computes the position by using dme/dme, vor/dme, ect. combinations, but sole use the gps input for their position. Hence max is RNAV5 or BNAV. That also includes G1000 non waas / egnos avionics. Do I get this right?
Fortunately this is not correct. A TSO C129a GPS (GNS 430/530) is capable of RNAV1 and RNP1 and RNP APCH. A DME/DME FMS is barely capable of RNAV1.
The combination of LNAV and VNAV(SBAS, Baro, radar alti)is required for PRNAV1 or 0.3
RNAV1 (PRNAV) is a 2D specification. No VNAV is involved. RNP APCH can be 2D or 3D.
NCYankee wrote:
I seem to see commenters conflating SID/STAR with approaches. Is there a reason for this? I have yet to see an approach plate with PRNAV on it, do they exist in Europe or is everyone just referring to the SID/STAR procedures when they discuss PRNAV?
It’s unusual (PNRAV is mostly used for SIDs) but they do exist
RNAV 1 in the US or its equivalent PRNAV don’t require WAAS, at least in the US. Is this different in Europe?
No. PRNAV is almost the same as RNAV1 though there are some minor technical differences.
Since AIP plate URLs have a half life of about 5 minutes, I have put a local copy of bookworm’s EHRS ILS 20 plate here, and the Jepp version here
Interesting to compare!
I don’t seem to be able to attach PDFs.
You can upload only images. I use this for a lot of stuff and do screenshots. Otherwise, if you email me some file I can upload it to local storage and give you the link to it. However I won’t have that facility until Monday (needs a proper computer).
Vladimir wrote:
A completely dumb question: Where do you find what the installation is approved for in a rented plane? I know where to find what kind of approaches are allowed (LNAV/VNAV/LPV) but don’t remember seeing anywhere the RNAV capabilities.
I would look in the AFMS or equivalent. Where else?
Peter wrote:
But the bit I highlighted shows one way to get in there with a non-PRNAV plane. (Note that TGL-10 is PRNAV).
It doesn’t Peter. There is a separate requirement saying you must have P-RNAV to fly there IFR or use it as an alternate.
If N-reg, it needs (currently) the FAA LOA which has been virtually unobtainable for years (some people got in under the wire, early on).
Peter, I have received three over the period you describe. This is just not true I am afraid. It is a pain in the neck but they are obtainable. Last one took me 1 month through the NY IFU.
Vladimir wrote:
Where do you find what the installation is approved for in a rented plane?
For HB reg planes: in the appendix to the CofA, which should be contained in the “blue booklet”.
It doesn’t Peter. There is a separate requirement saying you must have P-RNAV to fly there IFR or use it as an alternate.
Can you point me to it, Jason, so I can educate myself suitably? Thank you.
Peter, I have received three over the period you describe. This is just not true I am afraid. It is a pain in the neck but they are obtainable. Last one took me 1 month through the NY IFU.
I distinctly recall reading a post by you in the £75/year PPL/IR “private” forum where your alter ego hangs out with rather more informative posts (I am not a member anymore, after the treatment I recently got there – in the usual “GA tribal” fashion they seem to be very unhappy about EuroGA having been set up) where you reported the 1 year delay.
And others reported similar delays, on forums and to me personally. The only people I know of who have managed to got the FAA LOA all waited about a year. But there were never very many; my guess is around 10 GA people ever got PRNAV approval in the UK. GA is a very small scene and one gets to hear of things pretty quick.
Before them, one well known pilot got in under the wire very early on, by burying the NY IFU under a mountain of documents proving how great and well equipped his plane (a 421C; since sold) is and how many piloting qualifications and recurrent training he had. I got the details from him at the time. It wasn’t a viable route, frankly, for most. The route also wasn’t authorised or suitable for publication.
If that is no longer correct that is great, but you can hardly expect it to be common knowledge in the wider (much wider – only about 40 people ever visit that forum, compared with ~1000/day here) unless you distribute the knowledge in a suitable manner
If the NY IFU have finally got themselves organised, that is truly wonderful news. They have been completely useless for years, starting with telling me that EHSI=EFIS and needs an STC 
Fortunately, the big “cloud” of PRNAV has been delayed over and over and is still hardly significant operationally. And the latest news from bookworm is brilliant – the LOA won’t be needed at all. An AFMS, more or less, will do the job i.e. similar to LPV. Obviously that drives business to Garmin but that’s the situation in Europe today.
