From the Denmark medical scandal
The real world as always is a little more nuanced.
What I’ve seen personally is the AME gains a good income with little hassle for anybody by signing off people without issues, plus of course those willing to lie to him – something nobody can prevent, in 10 or 15 minutes. That’s $400/hr and everybody is happy. He then maintains plausible deniability and the image of credibility by running more serious cases through the system. In combination that’s probably the best use of his time anyway but those involved in the latter may not like it, especially if they’d heard of his normal practice previously.
None of it has much if any affect on safety, medicals for private pilots in particular are a pointless charade and AMEs know it, but they’re not following the rules by running most people through in 15 minutes and are susceptible to that being noticed. The next AME I went to was not much different for my 3rd class BTW, but in the end I decided that getting out of the FAA system entirely via BasicMed made more sense for me.
Silvaire wrote:
What I’ve seen personally is the AME gains a good income with little hassle for anybody by signing off people without issues, plus of course those willing to lie to him – something nobody can prevent, in 10 or 15 minutes.
That’s fascinating… Over the years I’ve had a couple of different AMEs for my class 2 and for all of them it took about one hour to cover everything even when there were no issues.
For almost 20 years I’d generally make an appointment in the morning, do the medxpress application online at lunch, then leave my office at say 5 PM to make a 5:15 3rd Class Medical appointment. I’d then be home by 6 PM for dinner. That was every two years after I turned 40, but nowadays BasicMed seems to be equally time efficient: it takes longer because the doctor isn’t familiar with the form but its every four years with some quick online ‘training’ every two years. I’ve done the BasicMed exam only once so far, at an urgent care drive-in place with no appointment possible or necessary. $120.
@Silvaire or anyone can you explain what BasicMed is. I had always been under the impression that it was similar to what you do for ULM here. That is you go to your GP and say I want to take up ULM flying, can you give me a note. He might ask some questions, look at your notes and perhaps check your blood pressure or even give a prescription for a blood test. All normal things a doctor does or thinks necessary when you pay him or her a visit for a check up or repeat prescription. S/he then gives you a note which says there is no reason why you shouldn’t fly an aircraft. You never need another. It is your responsibility, if you think there is something wrong with you, not to fly, and if necessary go see your doctor or opthamologist or hearing specialist or whatever part is wrong with you.
Cost, without blood test €25. Blood test depends on how many things the lab is testing for €15 to €30. Of course you don’t pay anything if you are going to the doctor as part of a regular visit and he gives you the letter of apte to fly at that time.
Yes I read the previous thread but I am confused regarding @Silvaire description of obtaining basic med cert in post 31 and 3rd class medical and the phrase " the aim to eliminate the medical requirement for pilots who fly LSA and only occasionally" as described in the thread you linked to.
Silvaire wrote:
make a 5:15 3rd Class Medical appointment. I’d then be home by 6 PM for dinner.
So what exactly happens at that exam? Over here you’re supposed to leave a urine sample which it tested. Your vision is tested (both acuity, near and peripheral vision). The AME listens to your lungs and heart, checks reflexes etc. There is also run through of a questionnaire. No way this could be done in 15 or even 30 minutes if you actually do everything. The questionnaire could in principle be done in advance, of course.
For the class2 medical I fill a form in advance (I posted it on here). The AME has his own form and ticks or fills in things as he goes through the checks. Listens to chest, ECG (EKG) , Eye test on a chart plus close up reading. Colour vision test picking out numbers from the background, shape check B+W picking out a shape eg diamond, square, triangle amongst a whole load of other dots on a page of dots, (haven’t a clue what that is for🙂, peripheral vision test he moves a pencil or pen from the side and you say when you can see it, hearing tests in which various frequencies are played through headphones and you hold up your hand to indicate that you hear a sound and in which ear it is.
There also used to be (and might still be at various AMEs) A balance test where you stand on one leg with your eyes closed while the AME times how long you go before you fall over, touch your nose with your finger tips. Sometimes also a breath test where you blow into a tube and see how far the guage moves.
There may be things I have missed and yes like @Airborne_Again it takes a lot more than 15minutes.
So what exactly happens at that exam? Over here you’re supposed to leave a urine sample which it tested. Your vision is tested (both acuity, near and peripheral vision). The AME listens to your lungs and heart, checks reflexes etc. There is also run through of a questionnaire. No way this could be done in 15 or even 30 minutes if you actually do everything.
All of that minus the urine sample, which I believe is supposed to be done for a 3rd Class but was never actually done in my experience with three different AMEs. The application including questionnaire must be done and filed online before you show up, and you give the AME the file number. The run through of the questionnaire takes 30 seconds if all the answers are ‘no’. The eye check is cursory, to determine that you need corrective lenses or not (near and far) and can at minimum manage 20/40 corrected (near and far). The AME does not attempt to be your optometrist. No EKG is ever required for a 3rd Class. It’s no problem in 15 minutes and I’ve noticed in my experience that no one wants it to be more.
@gallois, the description of FAA BasicMed in the link you reference is inaccurate. BasicMed is in effect and applicability much like 3rd Class if you fly anything smaller than a Cessna 340. The application and exam is almost identical except it can be done by any physician and no medical data is filed with the FAA. Only the date and physicians name is in the FAA file and the way that info is collected is by a cursory biennial online ‘training’ session done at home that requires you to supply that data – the physician has no contact with FAA. The medical difference is that there is a very short list of significant conditions that make you ineligible for BasicMed. Outside of those if the doctor and you agree that you are healthy enough to fly, you pass – there are no elaborate FAA criteria for every condition and no special issuance process, board evaluation etc. You can also go to another physician if you can’t come to terms with the one you’ve selected. Once you’ve passed, the exam lasts four years versus two years for a 3rd Class that’s done on anybody over 40 years old.
It would be great if private pilot medical exams would go away completely in the US as they have for pilots of N-registered LSAs, medical certification for private pilots is acknowledged as nonsense by almost everybody, but BasicMed is what we have so far and it’s not awful. The 3rd Class is not bad either if you have no significant reportable conditions or relevant medical history, with only irrelevant or routine doctor visits to report.
Airborne_Again wrote:
That’s fascinating… Over the years I’ve had a couple of different AMEs for my class 2 and for all of them it took about one hour to cover everything even when there were no issues.
I have have had medicals for over 20 years here in Europe, covering both FAA and EASA licenses. Always 45 to 60 minutes and very thorough. The guy I have used for the last few years, Dr Nomy Ahmed in N London, is very professional, and I consider the exam as a useful general health check too.
I did have reason to do a medical in the US once, some years ago in Florida, near a busy GA airport. As I sat in the waiting room I could see how this "AME conveyor belt’ was operating so decided to time it. My interaction with the actual doctor took 17 seconds “you look to be in good health”. “yep, I am feeling fine”. “good, let me sign those forms, my assistant will take your payment”. Obviously an extreme example, and very funny too.
