To work on your own certified or SLSA aircraft an owner must get the same training and rating as the A&P
Not correct; see the pilot maintenance privileges (essentially a whole 50hr check).
Experimental owners are also able to work on their aircraft if they built them from a kit and get training on engine maint. They are also not allowed to perform annuals even on an experimental without the proper certification and training.
Not correct; see Silvaire’s postings on this topic. The builder-owner can do it all himself. A subsequent owner can also do it all but needs an A&P inspection and signature on the Annual.
Europe has variations of this, with variations in the maintenance privileges between the builder-owner and a subsequent owner (many previous threads in the Non-Certified section). What Europe does not have is easy to locate regs so there is a lot of mythology around it 
Peter wrote:
The builder-owner can do it all himself.
Yes, to sign off annuals the builder gets an FAA Repairman Certificate for that airframe, a paperwork process that (more or less) goes along with his plane getting an airworthiness certificate.
Peter wrote some more:
A subsequent owner can also do it all but needs an A&P inspection and signature on the Annual
Yes, with a slight twist… If the builder sells the plane to somebody else that person can work on the plane with no qualifications but needs an A&P (not IA) to sign off the annuals, or the original builder who retains the Repairman Certificate for that airframe forever.
Mooney_Driver wrote:
you keep reminding me why my behind occasionally hurts when I remember the one time in my life when I had the chance to emigrate and didn’t….
It’s never too late!
Peter wrote:
What Europe does not have is easy to locate regs so there is a lot of mythology around it
That is not correct. The only mythic here is the English language. Not a single one of those regulation is written in English, but this doesn’t mean it’s all mythical for us involved with it.
Mooney_Driver wrote:
How is the situation now with the new Centurion diesels 135/155 if bought new today? What are the intervalls for gearbox and clutch (or are they the same?) What is the TBR now? I read 1500 hrs TBR and 600 hrs for the gear box exchange?
AFAIU the gearbox required a 600 hrs inspection and the engines have a 1500 hrs TBR. I believe there is no longer a clutch in the gearbox but a “double flywheel” whatever that means.
It is generally expected that the TBR will be increased to 1800 hrs but I have no solid reference for that.
Silvaire wrote:
The FAA does not have authority to prevent you from touching your own property,
You are not authorized without specific maintenance training similar to what an A&P gets to do anything other than some preventative checks and small replacements such as spark plugs, batteries, oil or a tire. You may not perform 100 hour or annual inspections. You may not make a structural change or modify the plane. You may not alter any portion of the airframe, replace or upgrade avionics, or do moderate to heavy maint of the engine or prop.
@USFlyer, working under supervision on any of that is legal. It’s the same situation that allows for employed trainees in maintenance shops, the key issue being that the maintenance log entry is made and signed off by an A&P when complete.
It is very important to FAA that you actually be under A&P supervision, in other words that the A&P be fully aware of what you’re doing and immediately available on site when needed. Here is some more detailed info on the legalities. The exact wording in the FAR is as follows:
A person working under the supervision of [an A&P] may perform … maintenance, preventive maintenance, and alterations … if the supervisor personally observes the work being done to the extent necessary to ensure that it is being done properly and if the supervisor is readily available, in person, for consultation.
Silvaire wrote:
person working under the supervision
This is not the same as doing the work yourself in a hangar somewhere on the field and that is what was contended in earlier post. In fact the contention was MOST work was done this way. When you have an A&P supervising you they also SIGN THE LOGBOOK and take full responsiblity for the work. That is hardly someone avoiding the expertise of an A&P.
Who said anything about avoiding A&Ps? Most people I know with certified aircraft (with one or two exceptions) do (say) 75% of the hands on labor, supervised by an A&P who signs the logbooks.
Other than the obvious labor cost saving, a key issue in cost saving is that an FAA A&P does not need to be professionally employed in aviation, or paid at all if you are friends trading favors or whatever. I once got my IA a (non-aviation) job with a 20% raise. He moved on to another 20% raise within a couple of months but happily he has never forgotten the favor
