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Favourite Route now impossible (EGJB-EGKA) !

It’s even easier than looking in the AIP – the UK ICAO charts have the ones with byelaws prohibiting entry marked with an asterisk.

If there is a crossing service available, there is a – wait for it – cross next to the designation.

I agree they should be restricted airspace it is rather silly this way.

Biggin Hill

I usually speak to Plymouth Mil or sometimes London Info will co-ordinate a crossing service.

Alex
Shoreham (EGKA) White Waltham (EGLM), United Kingdom

In fact, the majority of UK Danger Areas is not subject to any byelaws. Only about 10-15% of them.

Last Edited by boscomantico at 22 Oct 20:40
Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

These areas are carefully monitored both by the UK and France – that they go to 55,000 feet gives some hint at what might go on inside them. They are inactive at times, you just need to speak to Solent or Portsmouth and get a crossing service.

Oxford (EGTK), United Kingdom

Hmmm…… not many people knew that!

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

I think you’re right. UK AIP ENR 5.1 helpfully lists the Statutory Instrument you might be breaking for each D area. There are none I can see listed for the areas in international waters.

Legally speaking, even if (as opposed to ICAO standards) you need permission to cross a D-area in the UK, can the UK prosecute someone who flies through an active D-area in a UK FIR, but over international waters?

I expect not. In Swedish FIRs (Sweden does follow ICAO standards in that it is always legal to fly through an active D-area) there are no R-areas over international waters, only D-areas. In some cases you have an R-area inside the border and a D-area outside it. The only reason for that arrangement I can see is that R-areas over international waters are unenforceable.

That does not mean that flying through an active D-area is always a smart thing to do, of course. But it could be if you know there is no activity in the area.

Last Edited by Airborne_Again at 22 Oct 18:36
ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

It is a good question whether Eurocontrol should validate DCT legs which are OCAS. Probably not…

FWIW, in my 16 years of flying here, I have never seen those D areas not active. It seems a really obvious case of “declare it active or lose it” so the military keeps them permanently active.

This is a long term issue with Shoreham. It is not near any CAS routes (that validate for any “GA” flight plan) so everybody has to fly long DCTs to reach it, hence all the hacks

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

These are outside of controlled airspace. No enroute ATC will tell you what to do.

If you determine that the danger area is not active, you can of course fly through, but nobody will clear you through it. If it is active, in some cases you can still get permission (from the agency controlling the DA) to fly through it.

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

How would ATC in the UK treat Danger or Restricted areas different from e.g. France when flying on an IFR flight plan? As tou file the route more or less around them, would ATC not give you a more direct route if these areas are not active at the moment you actually fly?

Last Edited by AeroPlus at 22 Oct 05:31
EDLE, Netherlands
17 Posts
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