Thank you all, much more clearer about the operation of it now!
“ Yes exactly; much of the work with ATC is to present a fait accompli.”
As long as it’s not Class A ahead, ATC choice is very obvious: takes 15min to bring you down at stable -500fpm vs 10min to transit 30nm TMA at 140kts 
I once got pulled down slightly in north-east of France from FL105 but saying “it’s VFR on top” (FEW050 to be precise) was enough to win the day, it may not work in Nice though, too much sunny out there
Ibra wrote:
I once got pulled down slightly in north-east of France from FL105 but saying “it’s VFR on top” (FEW050 to be precise) was enough to win the day, it may not work in Nice though, too much sunny out there
Why should that make a difference in any case?
You can always say you can’t descend because of IMC conditions below and nobody can question that…
METAR reports are irrelevant en-route.
For sure one would not follow ATC directions if doing so would be dangerous, but they can get quite aggressive (not suggesting I have ever seen Belgian ATC anything other than totally good) and sometimes you get more amazing stuff like this. The best one, totally outrageous, is mentioned here but I didn’t get the sound track recorded (have a pilot passenger as a witness).
Alpha_Floor wrote:
You can always say you can’t descend because of IMC conditions below and nobody can question that
I agree but I was not the only VFR flying that day, I heard load of them flying probably in the 2kft-6kft band
ATC don’t look out of the windows but state of existing VFR/IFR traffic still indicate weather conditions
It depends on ATC attitude or what they have planned? sometimes “to avoid” or “for comfort” will suffice
Peter needs to publish his tactics to stay high untill the last minute 
LFAT to EGKA via SAM? “too cold for low water crossings”?
Just to revive this thread somewhat, does anybody have an experience of crossing Belgian TMA’s, especially Liège TMA between EHBK and EBLG? On the maps it looks like a pretty narrow corridor with very low space below me if wanting to underfly it. I am thinking of a flight from EDRK to EBOS (and then further to UK) in planned altitude ca 4000 ft in a C177, whether me or the plane is instrument-rated.
I’ve never had a crossing been denied to me from O to R for the CTR.
The if you fly south of Brussels, the gap between EBCI and EBBE airspace is also narrow with higher ground inderneath. If flying north of Brussels, the narrow gap between EBBR and EBAW has a lower ceiling to fly if you want to avoid controlled airspace.
If flying on the weekends, the EBBE airspace should not be active which is less hassle to fly.
I generally avoid controlled airspace while flying in Belgium apart from EBLG CTR who is generally helpful.
Hello Dr.,
although I started a little bit further south, I flew such routing, exactly at 4000 feet, one year ago in a PA28. Initially requested this to Brussels Info, who then handed me on to Liège Approach, then Charleroi Approach and then Brussels Approach. Very seamless and enjoyable.
However, that was on a Saturday morning. On weekends, the Beauvechain TMA is not active, and Chièvres airport neither (which facilitates entry into the western parts of the Brussels TMA). Not sure it would always work like this on a weekday. Generally, Brussels TMA has a minimum overflight level of FL90. So, depending on the weather as well, you need to be ready for plan B, which is to go low-level, which, yes, is quite low in some places, but no worse than in some other places in Europe where TMAs force VFR flyers to low levels. Actually, I did this on my return flight, without any ATC clearances across all of Belgium. For me. the was a straight line, without touching any CTRs either.
If interested in some more details, you can read up in the May 2022 edition of Pilot&Flugzeug.
Today, on Tuesday afternoon I just tried it! I filed a FPL from EDRK to EBST VFR in 4000 ft, routed via VOR‘s LNO and LGE inbound VRP E of EBST. PPR on the same morning over the website was no issue.
After leaving German FIS 5 min before Border point KOGES I switched directly over to Liège Approach. I directly requested Crossig TMA airspace C as filed and became answer, that the two airspaces C after the border are not active and I should contact Brussels Information.
So I repeated my request to Brussels FIS and became promise to be handed over afterwards.
2 minutes before entering EBLG TMA I’ve been handed over.
The controlller on Liège approach was now very friendly and cleared me on direct course to VRP E of EBST, maintain present altitude and present heading.
I’ve been soon offered descend clearance to 2000 ft and handed over to EBST radio.
All people we met at the destination were polite, kind and helpful.
The way back I routed through the narrow gap between EBLG and EHBK control zones and relied on my moving map (aera660 in the plane and iPhone running SkyDemon).
As I approached more and more higher terrain below Liège TMA on western heading, I requested from Brussels Info another handover to EBLG App and asked if a little climbing in controlled airspace would be possible.
No problem, 2000 or 3000 ft is OK for me.
I felt now much better by having some more air below me.
So as a result, it is definitely possible to fly VFR on a weekday through controlled airspace, even in low altitudes. You just have to be fluent in ATC conversation.
Good one ! Did you visit the hangar ?
