LeSving wrote:
Yes and no. There is no approval involved. A person (or several persons) simply has to “declare” that he starts a school (which sounds very “freelancy” to me
Everybody here understands that one freelance instructor can be an “organization”?
I’ve been reading the EASA Opinion 11-2016 and never mentions this possibility. Everywhere there are references to “organizations” and such things as an Head of Training, flight planning facilities, briefing rooms, rest areas, classrooms…. etc
For me it would seem clear that at the very least you need to establish a company. Whether this could be a one-person business or not may be debatable. But for me it’s clear that just a freelance instructor would not be acceptable under this new regulation.
Peter wrote:
Yes; as I said those are under some special scheme. Historically the USA had 6 schools in Florida and one is SoCal, all running under UK CAA approval.
There seems to have been a change in oversight.
When I did this end of 2012/2013 (PPL at the school in SoCal), those handful of ATOs were listed here:
http://publicapps.caa.co.uk/docs/33/082016StandardsDocument31.pdf
Now the same document doesn’t mention those schools anymore but has a note instead:
Training Organisations outside the UK
With effect from 8th April 2012, any organisation that has its principal place of business located outside of the territories of the EASA Member States, is under the direct approval and oversight of the European Aviation Safety Agency. Further information can be located via: www.easa.eu.int
Any organisation that has its principal place of business located within the territory of an EASA Member State other than the UK, is under the approval and oversight of the Competent Authority of the country where the principal place of business is located.
Coolhand wrote:
I’ve been reading the EASA Opinion 11-2016 and never mentions this possibility. Everywhere there are references to “organizations” and such things as an Head of Training, flight planning facilities, briefing rooms, rest areas, classrooms…. etc
For me it would seem clear that at the very least you need to establish a company. Whether this could be a one-person business or not may be debatable. But for me it’s clear that just a freelance instructor would not be acceptable under this new regulation.
DTO.GEN.210 Personnel requirements including tasks, responsibilities and procedures
…
(b) The roles of the representative and the HT may be fulfilled by a single person.
…
I agree, it is still an organisation. In practice though, when the requirements can be fulfilled by a single person, this is as much “freelance” as it gets, a one man/woman company. Briefing rooms, classrooms etc, the requirements are for a practical one to one situation.
There seems to have been a change in oversight.
When I did this end of 2012/2013 (PPL at the school in SoCal), those handful of ATOs were listed here:
http://publicapps.caa.co.uk/docs/33/082016StandardsDocument31.pdf
Now the same document doesn’t mention those schools anymore but has a note instead:
The stated weblink above is invalid. EASA directly supervises ATOs outside member states, as described on their website here
The current list of non-EU ATOs (15 total of which 9 in US) can be found here
I thought that in the past schools that offered easa training in the USA did so off the back of UK national approval
Approx 18 months ago this changed and now any approval outside of member states such as the USA could no longer use a member state and had to use EASA themselves to obtain approval.
Apparently the cost, bureaucracy and time required to get approved by EASA is so great that it’s no longer financially viable for USA based schools to obtain it that they don’t bother.
Bathman wrote:
Apparently the cost, bureaucracy and time required to get approved by EASA is so great that it’s no longer financially viable for USA based schools to obtain it that they don’t bother.
I didn’t realize that. So the EASA PPL in the US route that was so popular just a few months ago still is basically shut?
Patrick, for the US school that I understand you attended, nothing has changed. I can imagine that for a US school getting new EASA training approval today, versus an existing school, the process of direct negotiation with EASA would be daunting.
And you could never do anything outside Europe except a bare PPL or a bare CPL. No IR.
Maybe loggable hour building towards an IR?
The IR was never possible – well not since JAA, 1999 or so. That was an extremely tightly guarded business protection move by European FTOs. If a JAA CPL/IR would be possible in say Arizona, 362/365 CAVOK wx and half price avgas back then, then given that most ATPL candidates are young men (and a few women) with plenty of time and little money, the European ATPL pipeline would collapse.
I have read claims years ago that the IR was partially possible in the USA but the poster never supplied detail (which in the case in question didn’t surprise me).
Regards an “organisation”, this obviously depends on whether specific posts have to be manned and by different people. I know a guy who appointed various family members to the posts of an EASA Part M Subpart G which he runs from the back of his van. This is 100% legal of course, and he performs a great service because – until ELA1/ELA2 comes in – a freelance EASA66 guy can do all work on your plane inside your private hangar, and he arrives, inspects and signs it off! I also know that in some Part M companies they cross-share staff so e.g. John Smith in Company A holds a post in Company B and Steve Jones in Company B holds a post in Company A. And each of these also holds a post in their own company. But if the regulation doesn’t specify separate posts then, maybe, the CAA might – acting under the table as most of them do when they don’t like something – not approve the application if they see the same name for all of them. But even if different people are needed, just collect some daughters…
Peter wrote:
not approve the application
The key thing, there is no approval as such. The authority can only react to technical errors in the received papers, but the whole thing is per “FYI” regarding the authority.
It would be amazing if a freelance FI could train. That was possible in the UK up to the 1980s, according to a book I read from that era.
There are dramatic advantages for the right sort of client – busy, not short of money, looking for a real capability after getting the PPL.
The FAA scene delivers this (for the right client). I know at least 2 people who did their FAA PPL/IR on a long trip around the USA. David (EuroGA) was one of them.
