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What plane to buy? any recommendations

Once i complete my PPL in the near future and have enough hours under my belt, i will plan to buy an aircraft, i have done some research but would like some suggestions,

this is my criteria:

.I will be a basic PPL holder, with intention of doing IR to broaden my horizons... .budget will be in the region of 30k (+/- 5k) .intend on using to fly in the uk i.e manchester to bristol once every few weeks (weather dependant) .also intend to fly france, italy, greece as often as i practically can for long weekends... .A high safety record history is a must .must be a 4 seater .value for money on fuel

I know i won't get everything for what my budget will allow, but based on what i have said, which is the best all rounder for a newby like myself?...

(so far the only options im aware of are cessna or piper warrior)

any ideas? so i can start having a look around...

bristol, oslo

budget will be in the region of 30k (+/- 5k)

Per year or for purchasing the aircraft?

EDDS - Stuttgart

Well, for 30 grand you can have a reasonable pick of the spam can CofA market. C172's, PA28's, AA5's, TB10's etc. Are you intending to park keep it outside or keep it hangared? If hangared, I've seen some half decent looking Robin's at the upper end of your budget.

I suspect insisting on having 4 seats as a freshly minted PPL is likely to bump up the insurance a fair bit. Others with direct experience can pass further comment.

With AVGAS at £9 a gallon and aircraft engines in the aircraft you are likely to target being pre-historic at best, "value for money from fuel" is a bit of a nebulous concept. You'll get what you get!

Bear in mind with CofA aircraft at the end of the market you are targeting can have some nasty maintenance surpises. I've heard multiple people getting £10k+ bills at their first annual after buying a "cheap" aircraft. And that's before you consider side issues such as Cessna's supplemental inspection program's. If you're flying in Europe, you'll likely need mode S and an 8.33kHz channel radio which could easily blow another £5k. Tread carefully.

As mundane as it sounds, you probably can't go far wrong with a C172/PA28. There's heaps to choose from, getting spares and maintenance aren't likely to be an issue and they are well proven.

Per year or for purchasing the aircraft?

Or both? :)

EGTK Oxford

Well, obviously you should buy a Socata TB...

I will be a basic PPL holder, with intention of doing IR to broaden my horizons...

If you want to keep the same aircraft through an IR and fly it on airways for real, you will need a reasonably up to date GPS and realistically an autopilot, both of which add up to a fair bit of money. I bought by aircraft without the necessary avionics for IFR, and have upgraded as I went along - but it is certainly cheaper to buy an aircraft with the right avionics at the start if your budget will allow.

budget will be in the region of 30k (+/- 5k) .intend on using to fly in the uk i.e manchester to bristol once every few weeks (weather dependant)

If it only once every few weeks, then you may be better off in a group

.also intend to fly france, italy, greece as often as i practically can for long weekends...

For Greece from the UK, you really need a 900NM+reserves range, which is at the upper end of what is available.

A high safety record history is a must

We can all write pages on why our aeroplanes are the best and safest in the sky - the truth is that all common IFR certified types are about equally safe, with some excelling in a few small areas (e.g. the cirrus parachute is great for night flying and mountainous terrain)

must be a 4 seater

Almost all IFR certifiable aircraft are 4 seaters - but not with full fuel. This is fine as long as you limit your 4 up flights to short flights in the local area (I have a range of about 250NM + reserves with 4 moderate sized adults in my TB10, so any long distance touring is out).

value for money on fuel

There was a thread on here comparing MPG figures for different aircraft - the upshot was that there really isn't much difference between IFR light single pistons. The Pipistrel Panthera might stand out as particularly efficient, and the modern 2 seater rotax powered aircraft (e.g. CTLS, Pipistrel Virus) are much more fuel efficient.

I'm quite happy with my TB10 - the per hour cost is low, which is good for training. But if you realy want long distance touring then a Mooney M20R or TB20 or similar will give you the same MPG with much better endurance and weather capability.

At the end of the day, you need to compromise - think about the balance of your flying between local bimbles, short cross country flights (Manchester to Bristol is very short in just about anything), long distance touring. Then consider what sort of weather capability you need, how much comfort matters (can be a big factor for your passengers!) and what is available on the market.

EGEO

Per year or for purchasing the aircraft?

Or both? :)

There is an exciting looking L39 on sale at the moment - I added up the annual cost of flying 100 hours and it came to about 1.5 times the purchase cost...

EGEO

My recommendation: take your flight training, get your license, rent a few aircraft, start reading pilot magazines and slowly arrive at a conclusion on what you want.

I like the look of the TB20....

Achimha- what do you fly?

Do you own or rent?

Nate

bristol, oslo

If you have £30k to spend, I'd look to buy a 1/2, 1/3,1/4 share in the best 4 seater with as much instrumentation I could get in your vicinity. You wont get much useful for a single owner purchase with 30k (not with suitable IFR equipment an an autopilot). Plus any bills (and there will be some!) will then be split by however many other people are in your group. If I was you, I would look at either a high end Piper Archer II or III, or a Piper Arrow II or III. Going up the Piper Saratoga level would probably not be so economical within the UK. I dont know much about Cessna's but I am sure there are equiably suitable capable aircrafts of those types like the PA28.

Edit - I'd agree a TB20 would be even more desirable, though your probably not going to more than 1/8 share for £30k (just a guess).

A good IFR platform will take you 6 figures and the yearly cost alone will be 20-30k.

Living in the UK I would prefer to spend my money in a good non-equity group first. There are quite a few around. It will give you the opportunity to keep your money and to fly relatively good Aircraft at a reasonable cost.

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