Cars (all fuels and electric)

Guys this is just going around in circles.

We accept Norway and Sweden are perfect.

The other 95% of Europe and probably 99% of the earth are not. These have large populations which don’t have the space.

You don’t need Planning to park your car in the UK but you can’t run a cable over the pavement.

This is on Mali Losinj and is one of the million of exceptions

Someone spent a million or two. Means nothing.

Time to get back to flying.

LeSving wrote:

It’s mostly a combination of hopeless bureaucracy, poor planning/unwillingness to plan, and unfriendly neighbors then.

That pretty much sums it up for the UK market. ;)
Another “fun” is for the tenants – they can’t do anything at all either.

Same as everywhere else. Except the two.

There is a growing realisation that a lot of people have been “conned” into buying EVs which they can’t charge at home and therefore intended to charge at public points, without realising these are about 3x the cost of home charging, so not only is the car super expensive and with a poorly defined resale value, but also costs as much to run as a diesel or even a petrol car.

Maybe in some countries the charging point cost is taxpayer subsidised, otherwise clearly the stuff must cost way more than the long term wholesale price of electricity.

So there is going to be a lot of back-pedalling on this stuff. It’s just a matter of how a politically acceptable face covering can be organised.

That would certainly seem to be the case for the UK. The market will never take off with the retail price of electricty for electric cars is, as you have quoted around 500% more than it is here.
It seems even the small city EVs are being priced out there.
Here the Citroën Ami is becoming very popular especially as it can be driven without a licence and by a 14 year old. With a maximum speed of around 28mph its great for city and town use but no good for the open road.

Isn’t the price of electricity subsidised or capped in the UK? I was under the impression that it was pretty much the same as here.

Peter wrote:

without realising these are about 3x the cost of home charging,

That seems to be in the right ballpark, but even so it would cost me considerably less than petrol/diesel.

but even so it would cost me considerably less than petrol/diesel.

That surprises me.

A Hyundai Kona petrol is 25k-35k GBP.

Electric Kona is GBP 30k-41k. From a public fill point across the road from us, probably around GBP 0.90/kWh, it costs GBP 30 to fill it up. The range is 516km.

My VW Scirocco, 2012, cost 24k, minus 20% for finance paid off after 2 months but the nearest new diesel is the Golf TDi which still exists at GBP 28k, base spec. This does 1100km on a full tank which would cost GBP 90 to fill up.

So the diesel costs 8p/km and the EV costs 6p/km.

But that’s not the whole story. Chuck in

• the Kona numbers are manufacturer numbers; reality will be worse and anyway assumes no aircon no heating and very optimal driving style
• My diesel mileage is fast driving. Always just above the speed limit, no hanging around. Aircon is on the whole time. Heater is on a few months of the year (automatic climate control; never touch it)
• A more typical diesel will do 20% more mpg than I get; Justine has one of these (the Blue Motion Scirocco, very cheap road tax)
• Depreciation, assuming 5k-10k higher price, is higher
• Depreciation on an EV is much higher anyway

And the above assumes you can conveniently find charging points…

Charging at home is obviously a lot cheaper but some large % of people can never do that. The % must be known but isn’t published AFAIK. My guess is 75% of any developed country.

Then chuck in funny stuff like you can get your liquid fuel car remapped and get ~20% more mpg at the same power output, or 20% more power at the same mpg

Electric Kona is GBP 30k-41k. From a public fill point across the road from us, probably around GBP 0.90/kWh, it costs GBP 30 to fill it up. The range is 516km.

That is indeed expensive. Public charging in Spain is about half that.

Charging at home is obviously a lot cheaper but some large % of people can never do that. The % must be known but isn’t published AFAIK. My guess is 75% of any developed country

I’m wondering about that % too, and would love to find some real data. Maybe I’m biased, but my guess is more like 50% or even less. I remember seeing loads and loads of nice suburbs in the UK, all with a (small) driveway. One may argue that the bulk of the population lives in high rise buildings in the cities, but tell me, how many of these people own a car to begin with? And that’s not a matter of money. I see lots of young folks with solids incomes who decided they don’t need to a car and when they need one occasionally they use a car-sharing outfit.

Your financial analysis misses the savings on maintenance