I have both travelled and worked in the USA, a lot.
I wouldn’t want to live there. I could have, but it was not for me.
That being said I have met a number of very nice Americans, just like I have met a number of very nice Russians,Iranian, Chinese, Indians and Pakistanis.
The USA is a beacon of freedom and democracy, just, but for how long? Maybe it will become a dictatorship later this year. And yes @Silvaire I do watch a lot of US news channels.
As a European it is frightening to me that Trump is attacking NATO and encouraging Russia to attack NATO countries if they don’t pay what he feels they should pay.
One thing that MAGAts seem to have forgotten is that IIRC the USA has only ever won, one war without allies (usually those in NATO).
So IMO European Governments need to take DT at his word and need to prepare, before November, a plan for defence without the USA. With the budgets available to us, that will mean reducing our support for the USA when it comes to Taiwan and China. We will need to concentrate our defence closer to home. And that means being ready for Russian expansionism especially now they are being supported by those in Congress and the Senate as well as the likes of Tucker Carlson (who calls himself a journalist) and Fox news.
Live in the USA. No, thanks.
The USSR is very much around, as “Russia”. Just a new label.
I wouldn’t want to live there
I don’t think you have seen the US much. It is a vast country. Very different people and attitudes across it. I travelled a fair bit in the 1980s and 90s. The most notable difference however between the US and Europe is that if you asked 100 Americans what country they belong to, at least 99 would say America. Do the same in Europe and at most 5 will say Europe.
the USA has only ever won, one war without allies
Well, the US came to Europe to liberate Europe, so of course it had allies there 
It didn’t have to waste ~300k men doing that, and before Pearl Harbour it wasn’t going to. It then carried on to finish off in the Pacific, virtually single handedly.
It is right for France and the UK to have their own nukes, partly because everybody knows the US/NATO would not press the big button for Europe if it came to the crunch, and partly because USSR/Russia understands only one thing: muscle.
As regards others wars, they were basically communist-sponsored insurgencies and, yeah, unwinnable in retrospect, but the alternative to getting involved was to allow the obvious. That is the tragedy of an aggressor with nukes; Ukraine may be unwinnable for the same reasons, at least in the sense of a full return of original territory.
Trump is a dickhead, but his powers are limited… Let’s see what happens.
@Peter I have travelled to most parts of the USA and have worked in a number of states and cities. Yes they are all different but having weighed up the pros and cons I prefer to live in Europe.
I also do not like the way the USA seems to be heading. But of course that can change. And yes I know that things look pretty good under the Biden government, especially economically. But if things are so good why do opinion polls still show that Trump could well win?
You say Trump’s powers are limited, yet even out of power he seems to be controlling Congress when it comes to a border bill, funds to Ukraine etc.
vic wrote:
Allright, I cut it here, hopeless, just some on here disgrace themselves, I was expecting a bit more intellect of seeing the whole picture . . . Vic
I find it best to not engage in these kinds of conversations – I think the chances of changing someone’s views are close to zero.
Like many countries, the USA is a great place if you are reasonably successful, never have a serious health issue, have little empathy for others, and don’t mind the fact that you are generally surrounded by people that are struggling or very poor.
Silvaire wrote:
Europe is a better place economically for those who are dumb or lazy
Europe is everything from Russia to Iceland. The differences are as big as they get, at least regarding what one would call modern societies. What make countries good places to live in are things like minimal corruption, personal freedom, happiness, equal opportunity, health care etc. There’s countless stuff about this, and what tops the list is always the Nordic countries.
I could easily perhaps double my salary by moving to the US, and earlier in my career I have had many opportunities to do so, been asked several times. The only time I semi-seriously considered it, was in Canada (Calgary), which is NOT the US 
and it had little to do with higher salary (which in Canada wouldn’t be all that much more anyway). The point is that the western part of Canada and the Nordic countries (at least Norway) are almost non distinguishable when it comes to all the essentials in life and how you live your life. It’s not an exact match of course, but as close as it gets, not a larger difference than say between Denmark and Norway. The difference between the Nordic countries and France or even the UK are much larger, all things considered.
I think most people want to be (and essentially is) part of something larger than just themselves. The local community and the larger community is a big part of people’s identity. Then, especially if you agree that the local and larger community is made in such a way it makes life worth while, not just for you, but for most people, then there’s no better place to live.
Moving to Canada is not something I consider a closed case at all, even today. But, as life moves along, getting a nice little apartment in Spain and live there half the year is a more likely scenario (not all that likely, since both my wife and myself are too found of travelling, but more likely).
It may very well be that Europe is a better place for those who are dumb and lazy. But as far as the Nordic go at least, that’s something we are proud of. It’s by design. It’s not people’s fault they are born the way they are. They are still part of the community, part of “us”, and if the clever and industrious among us are not capable of creating opportunities also for them to contribute productively for the rest of us, then we are the truly dumb ones IMO. A lot can be said about this, and it’s a truly complicated thing involving all kinds of crazy psychological stuff. I have first hand experience from a close relative. I considered that person a lost case for many years (very far from dumb, but there’s all the other stuff in life). Through the ordinary county unemployment services and a very smart and vise high ranking individual at an international IT company, that person is now a lead programmer, excelling in what he does. Completely amazing.
that person is now a lead programmer, excelling in what he does
Presumably he found his niche
the USA is a great place if you are reasonably successful, never have a serious health issue, have little empathy for others, and don’t mind the fact that you are generally surrounded by people that are struggling or very poor.
Hmmm that’s true for most places in Europe too Especially the health stuff. You pay via taxes, insurance, or you pay directly. To a 1st order approximation there is no difference. If you pay directly or via insurance you get the job done faster. Differences across Europe do exist, as the covid business showed, but anybody with money “goes private”. The US costs more than say the UK because the system makes more money for those working in it, but a direct comparison is hard because of cross-subsidies in Europe.
Many many poor prople in Europe too, and every once in a while something blows up, and the rest of the said country wonders where the hell did that come from, we had absolutely no idea, and millions of people change their facebook profile photo background to the national flag
Peter wrote:
Presumably he found his niche
Obviously, and it didn’t come out of nowhere for sure. The point is, in the mean time the person wasn’t simply left out to rot, not even by the state. Looking from the outside, most people would describe it as laziness, anti social behavior and whatever bad description you can think of. But from dead meat to highly productive member also for the society/community in a time span of a couple of months. Who would have guessed? Evidently someone smarter than me did just that
eurogaguest1980 wrote:
Like many countries, the USA is a great place if you are reasonably successful, never have a serious health issue, have little empathy for others, and don’t mind the fact that you are generally surrounded by people that are struggling or very poor.
I think this is a bit of a myth. In larger cities for sure. But IME small town USA, which larger parts of the US consists of, is exactly as tightly knit as any small town anywhere. The social pressure is what keeps stuff in place, and the local mayor (and administration), the sheriff and a handful of local business owners are the ones deciding where the furniture shall be placed. For city dwellers (in multi million cities), and also for immigrants, these are difficult concepts to grasp and embrace I guess?
I rather peculiar if not downright nasty/racist example of this, is the city of Drammen just outside Oslo. It’s been hot in the news the last week. In Norway, integration of immigrants is very important. Everyone can come, as long as they integrate into the society. We simply don’t want “Swedish conditions” with ghettos and crime , seriously. However, the city of Drammen just took this a step further, a step too far in most minds. The local administration decided that from now on, only Ukrainian immigrants would be allowed. Immigrants from anywhere else would be dismissed. The reason was their experience with Ukrainian immigrants was they where particularly easy to integrate. They would be up to speed in no time, no crime, good productive citizens, fully integrated into the community. They are probably technically correct for all I know, but I mean…
Which other countries does Norway get immigration from?
In the UK, according to the Daily Trash, the main crime of Ukrainians (which are mostly women, since most of the men can’t leave UKR) has been running off with the husbands Well, who is surprised??
Peter wrote:
Which other countries does Norway get immigration from?
According to SSB, about 20% of the population are immigrants in 2023. Immigrants meaning coming from a foreign country, having two foreign parents and four foreign grandparents, and their children wherever they are born (If the children are born in Norway, they are “Norwegian born with immigrant parents”). By far the most people come from Poland. The next countries have fairly similar numbers, in order: Lithuania, Somalia, Syria, Pakistan, Sweden, Ukraine, Iraq, Eritrea, Germany, Philippines, Iran, Afghanistan, Russia and so on.
Immigration is the only way for Norway to increase the population. Norwegian women (or perhaps men?) being to lazy in bed New blood is good for the gene pool as well
LeSving wrote:
According to SSB, about 20% of the population are immigrants in 2023.
According to this article from 2017 Bosnians are also well integrated in Norwegian society (like in other Scandinavian countries) being 17th largest immigrant group.
