Sorry, it was shorthand for saying that we, as a nation, are not willing to pay sufficient tax to get the level of public services that they have in other, higher taxed, economies.
Sorry, it was shorthand for saying that we, as a nation, are not willing to pay sufficient tax to get the level of public services that they have in other, higher taxed, economies.
I dont follow.
In FAA land the airspace is hugely more joined up, but I am not aware they pay more taxes?
Timothy, I don’t think the sweeping statement that we’re a low-tax country holds water.
The UK isn’t a bad place to be if you’re very rich, and also if you’re very poor. But if you’re somewhere in the middle like me then you see a frightening proportion of the money you earn disappearing in tax. We may not have the high top rates of income tax like, say, France, but that isn’t the whole picture.
Our government collects an awful lot of tax. It just (in my humble opinion) makes very poor choices on how it spends it. Too many sacred cows that are bottomless money pits, too many endemic issues to which the only proposed solutions are spending another billion.
Graham wrote:
We may not have the high top rates of income tax like, say, France, but that isn’t the whole picture.
A middle earner will pay more in France than the U.K.
Graham wrote:
Too many sacred cows that are bottomless money pits, too many endemic issues to which the only proposed solutions are spending another billion.
I’d say that could be applicable to virtually any Western economy.
I think France doesn’t collect that much “pure income tax” per se, neither on personal tax nor on corporate tax. The rates are rather high, but there are so many adjustments, and so many people paying no income tax at all, the total is not that big. There is a smattering of other taxes, but that in my understanding that also doesn’t count for quite that much.
Where France leads the pack, is social security cost, the OECD highest at 16%-17% of GDP. My impression is that e.g. Belgium or Luxembourg have broadly similar social security services (in terms of unemployment benefits, health coverage, lifelong minimum income if you have none, …), but deliver those at a cost of 10%-11% and about 13.5% of GDP, respectively. Plus I don’t think the social security system is run as such a deficit than France is “famous” for having (whether that is still true is another question).
DavidJ wrote:
A middle earner will pay more in France than the U.K.
Really?
French Rates
From €9,711 to €26,818 14%
From €26,818 to €71,898 30%
From €71,898 to €152,260 41%
Beyond €152,260 45%
UK Rates
Personal allowance up to £11,850 0%
Basic rate £11,851 to £46,350 20%
Higher rate £46,351 to £150,000 40%
Additional rate Over £150,000 45%
They are not a million miles away from each other, but the French have an extra tier and there are some differences around the lowest rates. It depends what you mean by ‘middle earner’ (I think perhaps when we use it in an aviation context it means a fair bit more than the actual average wage in a country) but we Brits are into the 40% bracket far, far earlier, in fact 20k earlier, than the French!
Of course there are other taxes. An absolutely enormous amount is extracted from the ‘chattering classes’ in the UK by way of tax on alcohol.
It seems the French got rid of that very, very high top-rate of income tax that always kept their domestic football league weak when compared to the standard of their national team.
Graham wrote:
A middle earner will pay more in France than the U.K.
Really?
I should have been more precise. Yes, income taxes aren’t hugely different, but the French pay colossal social security contributions (and in return they have great benefits).
Is there any evidence that the way UK ATCOCAS (air traffic services outside controlled airspace) is set up is related to the UK tax system?
Peter wrote:
Regarding French ATC, I think it is a difference in priorities. But actually the UK is the odd one out in Europe. AFAIK in every other country the ATC staff is govt supplied.
In The Netherlands ATC is also privatised
Timothy wrote:
we, as a nation, are not willing to pay sufficient tax to get the level of public services that they have in other, higher taxed, economies.
It’s also possible that the issue is lack of respect for the proper role of government, with tax revenues that should be spent on basic infrastructure instead being spent on things that government should not address, the overall result being a highly taxed and ineffective mess.
