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No more Jeppesen VFR/GPS paper charts?

It is a while since I bought the paper Jepp charts but I get the feeling that they were always a bit "ambiguous" on whether a given pilot shop would sell this year's or last year's.

I am also fairly sure they didn't publish all of them every year, anyway. Let's face it - the UK CAA doesn't. The North chart is every ~2 years and the Scottish is every 3.

I am sure Peter Mundy's pilot shop always sells current stuff (when I bought from him, mail order, I always got new charts) but a very well known shop here happily sells a selection from the past; both of the Jepp VFR charts and the Jepp IFR (Hi/Lo) charts, all at the same price.

It is on the electronic versions (the Raster Charts, sold for Flitestar) that one seriously expects the most recent data. But maybe not... MM doesn't publish more often than the CAA paper charts, regardless of changes/corrections.

Incidentally, do Jepp dealers get stock protection on charts i.e. can they send back unsold out of date ones, for credit? Newspaper retailers do normally get this protection.

the lack of overseas charts

Just a comment for completeness: you can scan in any chart, georeference it, and run it under MM. I know 2 people who know how to do it (one of them no longer answers emails and the other moved to Ozi). I have tried and it is slightly bizzare. You end up with a QCT file at the end. There is little point in doing that, when Ozi offers a much more direct facility for DIY charts, and anyway all the various charts can be "found" for it...

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter - "pseudo-IFR" is my term, and it describes what I often do, and I'm sure many other pilots. Adequate visual conditions, legally VFR, but in reality popping up to a height where terrain is no issue, instrument nav with the odd cross-check visually, quite probably using GPS as primary navigation - but whatever height suits and nor declaring or necessarily conforming formally to instrument flight rules.

The Ipad version of MM is crappy and just about hangs in there, marginally aided by the marginally working Ipad2 internal GPS. In an "open" aircraft it should be OK but in a metal one you may need a remote GPS.

I'm planning a mixture of laptop-on-ground, Android phablet, and paper printouts. On my Phablet it shows UK 1/4m and 1/2m plus various non-aviation charts. But yes, you appear to be correct about the lack of overseas charts.

Genghis, I was talking to Jepp today, expressing my concerns and was told no decisions have been made regarding the publication schedule.

That I can't replace my ~15 month old charts with something more up to date, feels very like a decision to me.

G

Boffin at large
Various, southern UK.

I know all the national charts are good. The issue I have is different styles. You can easily cross 4 countries in 3 hrs. I can be confusing to use 4 different depictions on one flight. This was the big advantage of Jepp GPS+VFR.

If you just visit the next airfield there is no need for anything than national charts, but if you fly abroad on a regular basis it was a plus.

United Kingdom

Genghis, I was talking to Jepp today, expressing my concerns and was told no decisions have been made regarding the publication schedule.

EHLE / Lelystad, Netherlands, Netherlands

I've just made the decision to give Memory-Map a go for a while and see how that works as a substitute.

You will find it's fine. I have been flying with MM for years - ever since they stitched up the deal with the UK CAA. Under winXP (the old LS800 tablet) it was a fine product, with a basic functionality but working solidly.

The Ipad version of MM is crappy and just about hangs in there, marginally aided by the marginally working Ipad2 internal GPS. In an "open" aircraft it should be OK but in a metal one you may need a remote GPS.

Partly because MM never supported any non-UK aviation charts (despite stating they would) I mostly moved to Oziexplorer, under which I can run the same charts, even though I have to obtain them via other routes (converted etc). Ozi runs all kinds of other charts, for all of Europe as needed, and doesn't impose licensing restrictions. Functionality-wise - for aviation - it is about the same as MM i.e. close to nonexistent route planning facilities. It's just a moving map version of the paper chart, which I think is great - and the SD crowd disagrees

But there are many ways to plan the routes...

For "pseudo-IFR"

What is that? It does sound a little derogatory to pilots who for whatever reason have only got a PPL (anything more is a great deal more effort) but wish to use the best available tools to get from A to B.

VFR is flight in accordance with Visual Flight Rules. That is the privilege you get with the basic PPL. You are under absolutely zero, zilch, none whatsoever obligation to navigate using ground feature identification, which is nothing to do with flying legally IAW VFR. If PPL privileges required nav by ground features, radio nav would be banned unless one had an instrument qualification.

But you know all that

So I don't see that we disagree, and I agreed above that the 1:1M chart is no good for ground feature navigation.

I don't choose to put all my faith in a single system of GPS

I didn't say I do. This is one of the central problems in all these old navigation debates. Whenever anybody mentions GPS, somebody asserts that that person is relying solely on GPS. We need to get away from this because, in reality, anybody flying seriously will have multiple fallbacks e.g.

  • a second battery powered GPS (the most likely required backup for a GPS, by a huge margin)
  • a VOR receiver
  • a VHF radio
  • a view of the surface, and some idea of the general location, and a map (and the radio)
Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

According to posts today on the Flyer Forum some dealers have now been told by Jepp that they won't be publishing the 1:500,000 for the UK and a few other countries this year.

I disagree with you Peter - I don't choose to put all my faith in a single system of GPS (and I teach VFR flying and occasionally compete in no-GPS-permitted nav competitions, so need to use good paper charts for those, irrespective of anything else). The lack of virtually any topographic information, places names for just about anywhere smaller than a major city, or much by way of makes the 1m chart inadequate for true VFR flying. For "pseudo-IFR" (long high level legs VFR using radio nav), or national-level long trip planning, it's great and I like having one in my flight bag. There is more detail on a 1:250,000 chart than a 1:500,000, but not that much, and even my microlight at 60kn goes off the edge of one of those charts pretty quickly. Half-mil remains to me the optimal scale - and presumably to most other people as this is the favourite VFR chart worldwide.

I've just made the decision to give Memory-Map a go for a while and see how that works as a substitute.

G

Boffin at large
Various, southern UK.

Despite what some retailers are saying Jepp have not announced they will be stopping the VFR/GPS charts. No decision has been taken. The official line is that the resources of the mapping team were diverted to Jeppesen FliteDeck Mobile VFR.

The SkyDemon brigade will say that JFDMVFR is rubbish (as is everything not published by SD in their view) but for a 1.0 release it is not bad. I just wish they had not omitted the BeNeLux charting at launch.

Should Jeppesen stop publishing the VFR/GPS charts altogether I believe that would be tantamount to abandoning the VFR market ( as well as shafting the long-suffering dealer network)

EHLE / Lelystad, Netherlands, Netherlands

I was looking at the 1:1M UK chart at Transair just today.

I noticed it is composed by Cartabossy in France, which was amusing

the level of detail is inadequate to a lot of VFR flying

Perhaps it depends on the sort of nav you enjoy, and places you like to go to.

For map/stopwatch flying it is close to useless, but then the 1:500k chart isn't so good for that either - that's what the 1:250k charts seem to be for. They also cover the smaller strips. But many strips are not on any chart; I was once told by Sussex Police they keep an eye on 80 strips and most of them are totally private, with lat/long data in some strip flying publications.

But of those pilots who are likely to fly any distance for which a whole-UK chart has the slightest significance, how many won't be using GPS? In that case, the 1M chart gives you a really nice clean overview. It's amazing to see how much Class G the UK has!

That 1:1M chart got severely slagged off on the usual UK chatter sites so, in the context of radio nav (GPS etc), I did look at it closely and wondered what is really wrong with it, and couldn't see anything.

Sure it leaves out stuff like AIAAs but all they mean is that you ought to be in radio contact. Also the level of military flying in the UK seems awfully low these days.

I think I will use it from next year onwards. Saves paying for 3 charts and it covers Ireland too.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Cartabossy is a 1:1,000,000 chart, and whilst I carry their UK chart and find it useful, the level of detail is inadequate to a lot of VFR flying. Long trips - yes, a couple of hours fine nav in something very slow or finding an obscure grass strip, no.

G

Boffin at large
Various, southern UK.

That fits with my memory. So you miss the vertical dimensions of the danger/prohibited/restriced areas. There are so many of them, that that makes it really restrictive.

I know you prefer to fly on the airways, but to that adds too much track miles for no real advantage, so I prefer to negociate may way across airspace in the way. Also being VFR only, I don't have the luxuary of being able to guarantee a flight above FL65, so I could well end up lower anyway, meaning I'm back to needing those altitudes.

I always found the 5000ft limit on the IGN charts a pain, but see that's been increased this year.

Using PFMS has been the solution for me.

EIWT Weston, Ireland
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