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EASA/UK approved ATOs outside Europe, and acceptance of EASA/UK training done outside Europe

Aviathor,
Thanks for your long post.
More questions from me :

you do not need to do the full FAA PPL. It would be sufficient to get the FAA PPL based on your EASA PPL (FAR 61.75), then take the IR TK exam, then do the flight training.
Some N-pilots I met told me to re-do a FAA PPL or CPL, claiming some limitations of FAR 61.75, but I don’t remember why they said that.
I would definitely recommend you choose a FAR Part 141 school. You should have studied the IR TK before starting your training
I’ll certainly do that if I take the FAA path for getting my CB IR. I already bought ASA’s Instrument Flying Handbook an I’m half way through it.
You will be limited to flying on N-reg until you have 50 hrs PIC IFR and convert to EASA before April 8th 2016
What is this deadline? What will happen after that?
Last Edited by Nestor at 30 Oct 21:23
LFLY, France

Aviator,
Thanks for your long post.

I read somewhere that @Peter does not like one-liners

Some N-pilots I met told me to re-do a FAA PPL or CPL, claiming some limitations of FAR 61.75, but I don’t remember why they said that.

I do not know what those limitations would be. I heard some say that was to be able to continue to fly N-reg on FAA licenses after the new PART FCL basic regulations went into effect, but AFAICS even with a full FAA PPL you would need a EASA license.

You will be limited to flying on N-reg until you have 50 hrs PIC IFR and convert to EASA before April 8th 2016

What is this deadline? What will happen after that?

After April 8th 2016, unless there is a new postponement, EU residents (actually residents of EASA member countries) will no longer be a allowed to operate N-reg aircraft unless they have the necessary EASA papers. In other words, if you are a EU resident you will no longer be allowed to operate a N-reg aircraft in EASA land in IFR with a FAA IR. You will have to obtain a EASA IR. If by that time you can document 50 hrs as PIC in IFR, you will be able to obtain an EASA IR by doing a skill test.

Last Edited by Aviathor at 31 Oct 17:12
LFPT, LFPN

Yes I don’t think having a 61.75 FAA PPL or having the full FAA PPL makes any difference to the actual or perceived impact of EASA FCL.

The standard advice to get a full FAA PPL is based on the persistent hassles with updating the 61.75 when the underlying European license changes. Until very recently, there were just 2 guys in Europe who could do it for you and e.g. there were some comical scrambles going on when (IIRC) some large number of German 61.75 holders organised themselves to get theirs done but the “event” didn’t proceed for some reason.

I think the UK CAA can do it now, but I haven’t heard from anybody who has tested the process.

The FAA CPL (which I have too) doesn’t appear to have any relevance to any of this – unless you can find some European country where they will convert it to an EASA CPL while looking slightly the other way I am not aware of any such routes nowadays but obviously would not describe them openly if I did.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Thank-you.

LFLY, France

What is the CB stand for in CB IR? Can someone offer a brief explanation.

KUZA, United States

Stands for “competency based”. The idea is that the pilot demonstrates his ability not through the completion of a set course, but by demonstrating competency by other means. If you will, the CB IR is the equivalent of gaining your IFR as per FAR61, whereas the “classic” IFR equates to an FAR 141 course.

Last Edited by boscomantico at 01 Nov 13:35
Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

This is an interesting difference in teaching philosophy. Schools and universities all have “competence-based” courses. A pass grade is given on the basis of demonstrated competence — not by following a particular course with a particular number of hours. On the other hand, as soon as we move into the “industrial world”, so to speak, it seems to be most common that you have to follow a particular course with some number of hours etc.

Coming from the academic world, this has always seemed very strange to me. In the end, the important thing must be your competence and not how you achieved it.

ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

When I went to the CAA last week I took there opportunity to update my 61.75 licence. It has never been updated to a plastic card type as I have a stand alone FAA CPL as well, although that is Multi Engine only. The 61.75 obviously includes SE privileges so is worth updating. If anyone else is going, you need to take a utility bill as proof of address (an FAA requirement).

I will report back when/if I get the new certificate from the FAA.

It will be a good test.

Darley Moor, Gamston (UK)

Neil,

one can only hold one valid FAA license. If you also have a full license, then your 61.75 is technically no longer valid.

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

Which also means that once you replace your 61.75 PPL with a standalone PPL, you have lost the option of doing the US Foreign Pilot IR Exam route. The only way to get an FAA IR is to do the real thing (and of course credits are available for all training anywhere in ICAO-land).

On the other hand, as soon as we move into the “industrial world”, so to speak, it seems to be most common that you have to follow a particular course with some number of hours etc.

That happens because in commercial education (of all types, not just flight training) there is a whole load of hangers-on milking the business for all they can. If mandatory flight time or mandatory ground school time were removed, a lot of people would be out of a job. And I dare say (always the politically correct type, hey ) that a good % of these are people who, ahem, might find it challenging to find a real job…

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom
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