As an instructor I find doing night rating s pretty difficult. My local airfield had one hell of a drugs bust so there not keen on out of hours movements.
There are no airfields I’m the vicinity that allow night circuits (doncaster, Coventry don’t allow circuits after 2300).
In fact in the past we have used Prestwick but they then put up their charges to 20 quid a touch and go.
I was hoping that PCL would become more widespread now that the UK CAA allow it. But locally it would appear the uptake has been none existant.
Quite annoyingly as pretty well ever summer I have some kid who wants to do a CPL yet doesn’t have a night rating.
achimha wrote:
That was supposedly the situation before SERA (although I don’t know anybody that got actually fined) but now with SERA you have the right to file a flight plan in the air.
Thanks for the info, didn’t know that however that probably assumes FIS can and will physically accept it to pass on to AIS-C – I can just imagine calling Bremen Info, asking to submit a NVFR flight plan over the air for a longer route….. imagine how many pilots will be getting frustrated as they try to “request leaving your frequency” but can’t because I’m blocking it……
boscomantico wrote:
Yes, but not categorically. Germany has retained the SS+30 rule, contrary to SERA.
I would be quite surprised by such blatant contradiction to EU law, at least in the new version of the LuftVO, which I somehow had a hard time finding but there is one isn’t there? The NfL only contain information that VFR at night is allowed.
Quoting SERA Article 2 lit 97 “‘night’ means the hours between the end of evening civil twilight and the beginning of morning civil twilight. Civil twilight ends in the evening when the centre of the sun’s disc is 6 degrees below the horizon and begins in the morning when the centre of the sun’s disc is 6 degrees below the horizon;”
SERA is a EU implementing regulation and regulations take immediate effect in all member states (still have to consider opt-outs offered in the law) and supersede national law. Which means that of course there are some details left over to the countries, for example whether VFR at night is allowed (SERA.5005 c) but I am quite certain that no national authority can change the rules concerning night vfr, expect the minimum alts as laid out in SERA, and also certainly not the definition of night given in SERA.
And I guess that will be kind of a defining moment in the coming years whether EASA will actually come down hard on the national authorities for incorrect implementations of its rules. (Quite an old piece and in German: https://www.pilotundflugzeug.de/artikel/2014-05-29/LBA_zur_Grunduberholung5)
Are you certain that the requirement for IFR waypoints is still somehow in effect in Germany? In Austria all of this changed completely this year with SERA.
@Patrick Age would be a significant factor. And what’s used for training. It’s surprising to me that nobody managed to do better (assuming something simple was used). You of course need the 45 hours to get a licence (certificate). But you can use the spare time to transition into something hotter, more complex. Just like here. I don’t remember whether getting a night rating was also a possibility, it’s quite some time since I looked into training in the USA.
@boscomantico Maybe in Germany, it should be possible for example in the UK.
Martin wrote:
It’s actually 35 hours if something simple is used. Key to success is training intensively. It’s more efficient than dragging it out for months. But a lot of people can’t make the time
I don’t know. I’m the product of an American PPL sausage factory and you can say a lot of things about us but not that we dragged it out for months. 
I felt I needed those 45 hours (two sessions/per day for four weeks, roundabout) that I used and don’t recall anyone at the time needing much less. There was one guy who completed with 45 hours including the skill test and we all thought that was pretty good. I’m not arguing it’s not possible in 35 hours for exceptional talents or, as bosco said, people with prior experience, but I don’t think it’s very common.
Patrick wrote:
most people require more rather than less hours than the prescribed 45 hours
It’s actually 35 hours if something simple is used. Key to success is training intensively. It’s more efficient than dragging it out for months. But a lot of people can’t make the time.
I did a few hours of the night rating as part of my PPL, but we didn’t have the right weather to complete it so I had to spend a few hours burning holes in the sky (PFL shaped holes) prior to my skills test.
Yes, I just have never heard of anybody doing that. I am also pretty sure that no German flying school has that provision its training manual. Maybe the LBA wouldn’t allow.
I agree it would not be of much use for most PPL students, since they need more than the 45 hours just for the basics. But it would be great for those who come to the flight school with some prior flight experience / proficiency. They would effectively “save” 5 hours (most PPLs go for the night rating sooner or later).
@boscomantico From memory, law calls for 25 hours of dual, 10 hours of solo (including the cross-country) and 45 hours total. That leaves 10 hours unaccounted for. And there are schools that offer incorporating night rating into PPL training (with 45 hours total, not 45+5). The assumption of course is that you manage to do the PPL training with time to spare. Otherwise, it makes no difference. And the training manual, or whatever it is schools have, has to provide for this option, AIUI.
boscomantico wrote:
That last bit would be news to me.
To me, too and most people require more rather than less hours than the prescribed 45 hours to become proficient enough for the skill test.
