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FAA IR for Europe based pilots

What is important to realise is that the basic ICAO requirement that an aircraft on the registry of Country X (say the USA) requires the pilot to have licenses issued by Country X (the FAA) also.

So an N-reg pilot will still need the FAA licenses, ratings and a medical – like at present.

Nobody is changing this and nobody (apart from the FAA itself) can change that. EASA is not invalidating FAA licenses etc. They can’t do that.

What EASA has done is introduced a law which says that if the “operator” is EU based (etc) then the pilot needs to have EASA papers.

It so happens that these EASA papers will not even be valid for an N-reg as far as the FAA is concerned (ref FAR 61.3 – see my link above and the word “issued” here) once the flight goes outside the airspace of the European country which issued them. Take for example an N-reg pilot with the usual FAA papers, plus a UK issued EASA PPL/IR. His EASA PPL/IR is not valid outside the UK because it was issued by the UK and does not comply with FAR 61.3. But this is irrelevant. The EU “owns” the air above the EU and has the power to direct EU member countries to impose any additional requirements, such as EASA pilot papers. Or the wearing of yellow underpants, etc. The owner of the air can impose any additional requirements.

Last Edited by Peter at 24 Mar 19:18
Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Due to one or two failed Court Cases the UK has defdined “Operator”

Meaning of operator
257 (1) Subject to paragraph (2), references in this Order to the operator of an aircraft are, for
the purposes of the application of any provision of this Order in relation to any
particular aircraft, references to the person who at the relevant time has the
management of that aircraft.

I cannot find an EASA definition

So an N-reg pilot will still need the FAA licenses, ratings and a medical – like at present.

They will next year, but not right now? Right now you can fly your N reg on your nationally issued JAR or EASA license. You only need the FAA license, medical and radio operators license to fly the aircraft outside of your own country.

Move to Norway, Switzerland, Jersey, Guernsey, Isle of Man or any other country outside the EU and problems solved. N reg plane, FAA IR and fly anywhere you want IFR including EASAland. Why, because one is not an EU resident so the EASA nonsense does not apply.

EGNS/Garey Airstrip, Isle of Man

They will next year, but not right now? Right now you can fly your N reg on your nationally issued JAR or EASA license. You only need the FAA license, medical and radio operators license to fly the aircraft outside of your own country.

Yes; you are correct. I forgot about that. That will continue. But it’s not useful. A UK licensed N-reg pilot for example will not be able to fly outside the UK.

Move to Norway, Switzerland, Jersey, Guernsey, Isle of Man or any other country outside the EU and problems solved. N reg plane, FAA IR and fly anywhere you want IFR including EASAland. Why, because one is not an EU resident so the EASA nonsense does not apply.

Yes; and you will have a chance to vote at the EU membership referendum (if they really do run it, which I doubt)

Tumbleweed’s “operator” definition is also easy enough to take care of by e.g. a syndicate with a booking site on which the bookings are controlled by somebody outside the UK (IMHO, not a lawyer, etc). I don’t think a useful structure will be possible for a simple EU based private owner-pilot however, should this stuff ever be tested in the courts, and that is why I got the EASA papers – here.

Last Edited by Peter at 24 Mar 21:14
Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Just had an interesting email conversation with Orbifly (Swiss based) who tell me they are putting something in the pipeline to deal with this issue for EU resident FAA licensed pilots, will report when I have more info..

Flying a Commander 114B
Sleap EGCV Hawarden EGNR

Interesting that Orbifly are Swiss. The company was run by a former ATCO from Rouen, France, and her husband.

Anyway, those who want to explore the non-EU operator options have about 1 year to get something sorted out.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Based in Aubonne, Switzerland, we own some property not far from there so I know Aubonne well ! especially Ikea:)

They base their training in Cannes, I am considering them for the practical part of the IR training now I have the Theory out of the way. BUT need a resolution to the EASA issue before I commit time to this.

Hence the conversation…

Flying a Commander 114B
Sleap EGCV Hawarden EGNR

I hope a solution is found but doubt a generic solution will succeed as an individual will still be practically operating the aircraft. I think it will unfortunately be harder and more expensive to make this work.

EGTK Oxford

There will undoubtably be cost, after all its a mix of aviation and crazy politics !

Flying a Commander 114B
Sleap EGCV Hawarden EGNR
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