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Flying to Iran - a good idea?

Bosco, great trip report. Any reason you couldn’t go Batumi – Burgas direct? Obviously you would need overflight permits.

EGTK Oxford

Not sure about this ‘nothing in Ukraine’. Admittedly it’s been about 10 years or so, but the last time I was at Antonov Aircraft in Gostomel, we went flying in a couple of light aircraft (before taking the 225 up – which doesn’t really qualify as ‘light’ ), amongst them an AN-2 and a Wilga. Definitely Avgas territory of some description, may well have been ‘B-91’ or similar.

Just another vote for Tbilisi – I was there back in 2002 (not on GA – I went BA ) – absolutely amazing place. This was back when Shevardnadze was running the shop. At the time there was a vague lack of safety in the city & the recent civil war still fresh in people’s minds. However, I’m told the situation has improved immensely. Like Bosco mentioned, the country is stunning & Georgia has an ancient and interesting culture. I’m definitely planning on flying the DA42 there some day.

I went to Baku on the same trip as well. (flew from there to Tbilisi on a Yak 40) Quite an interesting place for people with an interest in CIS/post-Soviet countries. Azerbaijan actually feels a bit like Turkey, only not so well developed. I’d love to fly the DA42 into Baku as well, but I sense from Bosco that you’d get completely f’d up if you turn up light GA style! (Bosco, any details?) I quite enjoyed Baku & the surrounding oil fields. Surreal place.

I wouldn’t attempt any of these countries on an avgas burner. While it’s perfectly feasible transiting the region on avgas, any domestic & regional touring would require a lot of luck. Like Peter says, you’re setting yourselves up for unbelievable hassle if anything trips you up. Worst part is that you have to compromise your routing options to fit the fuel schedule. (I have heard, though, that avgas is plentiful in Iran)

I’ve been flying the DA42 around South East Asia for the past 6 months, and I can’t tell you how liberating Jet A has been. (in addition to being dirt cheap – my fuel bill is almost half of what I spent on the DA40-180)

One final consideration – while I’m personally fine with flying a SEP anywhere, having a twin or turbine sure does bring a comfort factor touring these remote regions, including crossing large stretches of desert, open sea or mountain ranges. A Silver Eagle would be an excellent turbine choice.

Last Edited by Hodja at 25 Jan 03:45

Silvaire,

there are quite a few AN2’s in Europe. For once, there is something which is more liberally handled in Europe than in the US, AN2’s with Hungarian or Baltic registrations are a common sight here. They all run on Avgas.

I flew the AN2 in Bulgaria for a while, made my rating in the 1990ties when they charged 170$ per hour! Never regretted it, the AN2 is a wonderful airplane and the Bulgarians of the Aeroclub at the time were super people to be around. They had their own deliveries of fuel from the military and I believe it was different from Avgas. However they fuelled the whole park of airplanes they had with it and everything worked fine. What Western operators need to be careful about is Oil. The engines need to be converted from Russian to Western Oil and the two can’t be mixed.

Since Bulgaria joined the EU however, the number of AN2’s has gone from well over 100 to less than 10 as fuel and requirements and associated costs went through the roof. Also, the whole cargo fleet using AN12’s had to flee the country and go to Ukraine. In 2013 I saw some of the planes come back to use after the first “obedience” mania vs the EU started to become more pragmatic and AOPA made it’s way there and they also found out that Hungary and even Germany allow the use of AN2’s just fine, contrary to what the first EASA raiders had told them…. Hopefully they will bring some of them back. “My” bunch of AN2’s (the aeroclub ones) are all shacked up in Dobric these days and hope for buyers. Had I got the money I’d buy one tomorrow, but 300 liters avgas per hour, or one full fuel of 1200 liters and 100 liters oil…. nope, not for me.

LSZH(work) LSZF (GA base), Switzerland

Just a couple of AN2s around here for reasons you well understand, Mooney Driver. But we have a lot of Yak-52s and quite a few 50s too. I get annoyed that the 50s are typically dressed up as warbirds despite their WAC aerobatic history but that’s me Obviously they are all running on 100LL here – my curiousity was about what they run now in the areas where they were originally built to operate, to include Ukraine etc. It stands to reason that as you and boscomantico have said there was (is?) something other than 100LL spec fuel supplied for them…

Maybe we’ll meet at Friedrichshafen in April and figure it out Likely we’ll be there on the Friday and I’ll post something on the dedicated thread when my timing is determined for sure.

Last Edited by Silvaire at 25 Jan 04:55

Silvaire,

lovely, I’d like to meet you at last.

I can ask my friends in BG what fuel that was, I think it was with lower octane than 100LL. Somewhere in the back of my mind I seem to remember something like B91. They don’t have it anymore, as the air force does not fly piston planes anymore so they use 100LL where it is in use to my knowledge.

LSZH(work) LSZF (GA base), Switzerland

My biggest concern with Iran would be what if the airplane breaks down and needs spare parts to be repaired. That could be next to impossible to resolve due to the embargo.

Much of the world today is at war, on and off, or is just too violent and with zero value attached to a human life as a result of the locals having been exposed to brutal behaviour by others, and this wasn’t necessarily the case decades ago.

One keeps reading statements like that but is it actually true? My feeling is that the world is a lot more accessible these days with widespread knowledge of English, internet to research and make contact, etc. Even in the most remote desert places in Africa I have always found somebody that speaks one of the classic European languages I learned. Some places that were GA hell are now OK (India for example) and both the East and the West route down to South Africa are safely possible these days.

And thanks to every corrupt politician and mafioso on this planet driving a high end German car, there is quality gasoline available virtually everywhere. If the warlord’s S600 can run on it, so can my Cessna

Yes – with local contacts (made possible via the internet) a lot more becomes possible. But without them?

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

The B-91 spec can be found here. Looks like there is quite a bit of lead in there.

The closest I ever got to actually using B-91 was in Simferopol, in 2003, where it was listed in the AIP. However, after landing, I inquired with the ops people there but they shrugged their shoulders and said the only fuel available was JET-1 (tagged “TS-1” over there).

I just had a quick look through the ukrainian AIP and the B-91 entry has vanished for UKFF, as well as at most other aerodromes, so yes, B-91 seems to be on its way out and the local piston aircraft seem to use mostly 100LL now.
The problem for visiting or transiting pilots in countries like Ukraine ist that their “GA” takes place mostly at small, domestic airfields, many of them for agricultural use. So that is where they keep their stocks of Avgas, be it B-91 or 100LL or whatever. But foreign pilots will usually not receive the permission to fly to these domestic airfields.

Georgia was a similar case. There is in fact a nice small GA airfield west of Tbilissi, with a hard 800m runway, 100LL, a flight school with a Cessna 172, etc. My georgian friend would have have been more than happy to pick us up there and offer us a beer straight from the hangar fridge after landing. The problem is the permission. Plus customs obviously.The latter could obviously be dealt with by first flying to the AoE, than to the local GA field, and then back to the AoE again. But that will almost double the horrible fees. So it just doens’t work. Unfortunately.

BTW, when we are talking about fuel in the context of these places, let’s be a bit careful of the terminology. B-91 is an Avgas, just like 100LL. Even in the context of central Europe, we now need to be a bit more specific, as we have UL91 Avgas now. Sooner or later, we will have some kind of 100UL. The last two pilot generations (say, from 1980 up to today) have got used to equate the term “100LL” with “Avgas”…

Just to prove the point that there is some Avgas (including 100LL) almost everwhere, here is a pic I took at Sochi (please excuse the reflection):

A russian registered C340, parked next to us. Now this one will definitely not run well on some unspecified mogas…

Last Edited by boscomantico at 25 Jan 08:21
Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

Bosco, not a 340, looks like a vintage 414A – quite a few old twins are making their way East.

I think that a Beech 18 can run on mogas: now that would be a good carriage for this region.

Oxford (EGTK), United Kingdom
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