Insurance companies, premiums, exclusions, etc

@terbang I came across this post on the topic of “agreed value”, which suggests things don’t work the same way in Germany, for example.

First time I hear that and not my experience at all. I’ve heard the following (no personal experience): say your plane is worth 200k and you agree on a value of 100k with your insurance company. Then say you bend a wing at the corner of a hangar and repair is 20k. Allegedly insurance companies payout 10k as the plane is under-insured.

Yes; that is standard. The argument goes: if you go around in a car worth 50k but you insure it for 25k, the insurer was exposed to risk worth 50k not 25k. So any claim gets paid out at 50% of its face value The English term is “averaging” – example.

That post was written by one of the “gods” of German GA (well, he flies a TBM now so is out of “GA”) so I assumed he would be familiar

The big Q is whether averaging can apply to under-insurance too, with Agreed Value. AIUI, averaging is not applied in the UK if you insured for Agreed Value and you under-insured. But I would need to check. I have been specifically told that if you over-insure you will get the agreed value, but there are some limits, to avoid obvious fraud.

I reckon, with today’s inflated market values, there must be a fair bit of payout averaging taking place, but I haven’t heard any actual stories.

Hello, first post here.
I recently got my PPL and for now I’m flying rented Cessnas out of a Luxembourg club.
We have an insurance policy that covers damage to the aircraft but it has an high excess and doesn’t cover any civil responsabilty for the pilot.

Are there insurance policies out there that would cover the pilot excess and civil responsibility in the event of an accident?
I sent a few emails around to aviation insurance companies but got no replies

Jorge, I think in the UK that would be https://flyingcover.co.uk/
Try them? They might recommend someone in continental Europe.

I’m not sure if I understand. I’ve never heard of a private individual, a club or a company that operates an aircraft without third party liability cover and with aircraft damage cover. The reverse, yes. Third party liability cover costs a fraction of the aircraft damage cover, so I don’t understand why your club excluded it and is that even legal?

As to the excess, how high? I remember once asking for a high excess to see what that brings in premium savings and I was not impressed, so the reverse must also be true.

EDIT, reading your original question again maybe I misinterpreted, and the aircraft damage itself and damage to third parties and pax is actually insured and you are talking about a certain civil responsibility that you have that the insurance does not cover? Assuming that you are not going to fly drunk, stoned or fly without a licence/medical, what kinds of risks do you foresee?

Try looking here, it is unfortunately in German but Axa offers a sort of pilot indemnity insurance to reduce any excess for charterers / students to zero in Germany, perhaps you can ask your local insurance rep if it can be expanded to cover you?

Copied from my MunichRe Policy, until May 2024. Meaning???
13. Non-Owned Aircraft

In addition to the aircraft shown in the Schedule of Aircraft Insured the cover afforded by Sections II, III and IV of this Certificate applies to aircraft used by the insured, always provided the Insured:

a. has no interest in the aircraft as owner in whole or in part,

This Extension does not apply:

a. to liability arising out of any product manufactured, sold, handled or distributed by the Insured;

Thank you all for the links, I will have a look tomorrow.

Insurance – French (F-reg) SEP aircraft

Gents,

Any recommendations for F-reg, SEP (certified) aircraft, insurance companies? Aircraft based outside France.
Merci.