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VFR Take-off at EDMS today ...

I have Italian friends living in Basel so you never know

Silvaire,

if you ever stay near Zürich, let me know. I’d be happy to meet and have a few local beers :)

LSZH(work) LSZF (GA base), Switzerland

Mooney Driver, last time I got the ‘light show’ of speed cameras in CH I was on my way up the old Gotthard Pass road (not the tunnel) from Altdorf up to Andermatt, it would’ve been in 2010. I was tired and ran though one of the villages over the limit. There were certainty several bright flashing lights but no police… I’ve seen that setup a lot at the entrance to alpine villages, cameras but no people accompanying them to stop you. My registration plate does not indicate the country it comes from, and the registration database is confidential regardless. Presumably as a result nobody has stopped me at the Swiss border since.

Mostly we stay in Austria or Italy now for better hotel values, so we often criss-cross the CH border when riding Swiss roads. I did stay in Locarno in 2012 and Davos in June this year – both nice enough but totally incredible prices. I’ve had the same light show happen in Austria, in 2009, but on that occasion my buddy following me with a German plate got a modest fine mailed to him through the rental agency. He chose to pay it, saying he didn’t feel too bad making a modest contribution to Austria’s main industry – road tolls and fines

Last Edited by Silvaire at 20 Dec 22:38

Really? I would have thought they’d keep him in until it’s paid.

Technically, we were not yet in Switzerland but still “airside” at the entrance door of the GA terminal in Zürich, so they probably could not force him to stay there. It was very embarasing for the poor guy with his co-workers secretly giggling around him…

The Gotthard Tunnels, they are really strict about those.

I can understand that during the day, but in the middle of the night? I worked in northern Italy for three years (1989-92) and drove back and forward every second week (alternating between road and train) so I must have done the Gotthard route more than 100 times. Several times I drove through the main Gotthard road tunnel late at night behind a “Postbus” that did 110-120 km/h…

EDDS - Stuttgart

Silvaire,

used to work like that, no longer. These days they will actually confiscate the car in this case until the fine is paid.

what next
bq. Do you want to pay that right now or would you prefer that your pilot flies you right back to where you came from?”

Really? I would have thought they’d keep him in until it’s paid. Unfortunately, they had LOTS of problems with foreigners who would not pay their fines and thought they are safe outside the borders. No longer. Nowadays pay or stay is enforced. I am told this had a lot to do with the Cannonball runners who cross this country regularly.

The Gotthard Tunnels, they are really strict about those. The trouble is, that even a small accident can cause disruption of the whole traffic flow and the consequences are enormeous. I remember when one car whose engine decided to stop in the middle of that tunnel caused a 10 km traffic backlog on both sides within half an hour or so…

LSZH(work) LSZF (GA base), Switzerland

One solution to Swiss speed cameras is a non-Swiss, extra-EU registration plate.

The important bit of this sentence is the “extra-EU” part. I once had a passenger to Zürich who was stopped at the passport control: “Sir, according to my information you have an unpaid fine open in Switzerland. Do you want to pay that right now or would you prefer that your pilot flies you right back to where you came from?”

The only speeding ticket I ever got in Switzerland was enforced immediately. They has a road block a few hundred metres behind their radar installation and it was either “pay or stay…”. They didn’t even look at my number plate, only at my wallet (200 CHF for doing 99 km/h instead of 80 inside one of the tunnels of the Gotthard motorway – all alone in the middle of the night. And he said to me: You are really lucky, above 100 km/h and it would have been really expensive!).

EDDS - Stuttgart

One solution to Swiss speed cameras is a non-Swiss, extra-EU registration plate. Once I had a funny conversation with a Swiss guy who said that their authorities would post the fine to the authority where the vehicle is registered, and the fine would catch up with me. He was mildly shocked to hear that likely nobody there would know where CH is, would care even less, and the letter would go in the round file

I’ve never heard of a real world case of an insurance company refusing to pay out as a result of ‘gross negligence’ but on the other hand I try to avoid doing business with insurance companies. I carry liability only in flight, and have flown without any insurance from time to time, legally. In 40 years of operating vehicles, I’ve never made an insurance claim.

Last Edited by Silvaire at 20 Dec 13:12

In the UK there are two completely separate scenarios: a criminal prosecution (which requires a proof BRD) and a civil action (which requires to be proven on a “balance of probability” basis). Is that not the case in Germany (and everywhere else in civilisation)?

Basically yes, you are right. But still, the insurer has to provide some kind of proof for the “gross” part of gross negligence. Not long ago I read an article in a flying magazine on the subject. Their example was weather related: If a pilot obtains a weather briefing, decides to fly regardless of the conditions and damages his aircraft in a forced landing, this will be regarded as “simple” negligence only. It is everyone’s right to make a mistake and misinterpret a weather report. But if he flies without any weather briefing at all (or unable to prove i) and gets caught by bad weather, then it will be regarded as grossly negligent.

So coming back to the original topic: I (as an “amateur insurance lawyer”) would probably be unable to prove gross neglicence if alexisvc would have taken off in the conditions he described and hit a runway light or something similar. No IFR procedures in place means that he needs class G VFR conditions in order to go. So in the absence of a qualified meteo observer or calibrated measurement system, only his estimate of the conditions can determine whether he can go or not. The testimonial of the radio operator will not have more weight before court than the pilot’s – after all, class G minima require a certain in-flight-visibilty (“Flugsicht”) and not visibility from the tower.

Last Edited by what_next at 20 Dec 12:44
EDDS - Stuttgart

Hi MooneyDriver

yes, of course.
The speed limits are not a problem for me. I respect them always – and I drive as fast as possible where it’s legal.

It would be a pity if GA would have to do without your articles.

Very nice of you thank you! I am actually glad I don’t have to work with some people anymore. Sometimes in life you realize that you are wasting precious time, and my late carreer as a freelance contributor was one such case. But, as my wife recently said: One door closes, five other open in front of you. I’ll take care about my “other” company in the near future (that actually pays for the flying), and maybe write some more flying books. More fun anyway.

Greetings!

Alexis,

I think we need once to have a couple of beers and talk about a few things. In the end, we are on the same side and were in the same profession.

As I said, I do not regard Germany as a police state but as one in which bureaucrats have an uncomfortably high influence on daily life. It´s not uncommon that if you live and work inside a society like that then it won´t bother you after a while. There are enough things here which disturb me too and I have to be on my toes not to get too used to them :)

Apart, we are not in a competition which country is the worst / best… we are in fact all in one boat: GA. And that we should try to promote and to fight and counter ANY transgressions we can.

have you ever broken the speed limit on a Swiss Highway? + 30 km/h costs up to 2200 CHF, 1500 Euros. Germany: 80 Euros.

No, I know the consequences and therefore have a GPS which warns me and I am a pretty careful chap as you probably have noted by now. My worst speed limit violation in by now 32 years of driving was 10 km/h once on a motorway and that cost me I believe 250 CHF. 30+ for a Swiss citizen means he will be taken to court, probably loose his license for at least a year and get a fine in the region you said (it is dependent on income) plus court cost. We all know this so we are careful.

I do hope you will find a new home as a journalist again. It would be a pity if GA would have to do without your articles. I am working on my writing future as well as we speak :)

Last Edited by Mooney_Driver at 20 Dec 12:08
LSZH(work) LSZF (GA base), Switzerland
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