How does flying with IMCR / IR(R) *really* work?

I’ve flown IFR a lot on IR(R), and found that there is not much of a problem with navigation etc. The way I used the rating wasn’t just to “fly through small fluffy cloud”, but going some distance (from Elstree to Middlesborough, Doncaster, Wales, south coast etc).
Yes, ATC sometimes don’t know the waypoints (even Farnborough don’t know some IFR points and they DO direct IFR traffic!), I just find some visual point nearby the point they don’t know.
For EGCB-EGMC – I’d go something like NAPEX-ABBOT, although I don’t know how would you depart from Barton with all the CAS around – does Manchester R/V you through or do they send you all around?
Upon arriving to EGMC it will be the usual – listenning to ATIS and then “G-ABCD, information Lima, QNH 1018, request radar-vectored ILS 23 approach”, and they’ll descend you from your FL/alt and R/V to the localiser as they’d do for a person with normal IR, no difference at all
There is not much difference in terms of license privileges legally – the two things are 1500meters min vis and no Class A access, otherwise – use it as you please.

My only advise is to fly with an experienced IR pilot first few flights – initially the workload was a bit overwhelming. :)

I fly with an IR(R). You are right that airspace will prevent you from climbing above the cloud on most occasions unless you are out in the west country or north of London, where it begins to thin out considerably. This is simply one of the limitations of the IR(R). Whether you’re happy to sit in IMC for extended periods might depend on whether you have autopilot or not, personally I wouldn’t do extend IMC flight without AP.

IFR transits are usually fairly easy for places with higher class D ceilings such as Southampton, but somewhere like Stansted I don’t think I’d try in IMC.

Controllers at airfields with instrument approaches are going to be familiar with the local IFR waypoints, though LARS services aren’t always. Farnborough are often fine with me reporting that I’m “routing via HAZEL” for example but one time the controller told me that they couldn’t see the reporting points on their screen, and to use a town name instead.

Barton to Southend looks quite straightforward once you are east of Manchester’s airspace, then approach Southend from the north.

My instructor tells me that many ATCs are not familiar with their local IFR reporting points, so providing location reports and verbal intent containing them would not be easily understood.

I can’t see how this could possibly be true. There are a few videos online from various radar units. For example inside the Farnborough LARS they have: little boxes with trails for the aircraft, navaids, airspace boundaries and maybe the coast line.

I’m sure ATCO would know exactly where somewhere the size of Guildford or Woking are in relation to their display. However, given they can be dealing with areas which are quite distant from where they based, telling them the name of some village with 10 houses is probably pointless.

Unless you are talking about some non-radar unit. In which case you may as well talk to yourself 😆

LondonMike wrote:

My instructor tells me that many ATCs are not familiar with their local IFR reporting points, so providing location reports and verbal intent containing them would not be easily understood.

I can’t see how this could possibly be true. There are a few videos online from various radar units. For example inside the Farnborough LARS they have: little boxes with trails for the aircraft, navaids, airspace boundaries and maybe the coast line.

I’ve experienced that myself – “.. on route ABCDE – FGHIJ …” twice had response from Farnborough – “unfamiliar with IFR reporting points, please provide the visual references”, while I was flying IFR! Both times were Farnborough East.

arj1 wrote:

I’ve experienced that myself – “.. on route ABCDE – FGHIJ …” twice had response from Farnborough – “unfamiliar with IFR reporting points, please provide the visual references”, while I was flying IFR! Both times were Farnborough East.

I’ve had same.

Flying IFR without privileges to use the full procedures (above the weather, ATZs and VFR chaos below) is an interesting problem.

I don’t quite understand the inference here: Apart from entry into Class A airspace, filing/flying IFR, Squawking 2000, receiving traffic advisories, using & flying available procedures to IR minimums (see discussion in another post on this) the IR(R) has no further restrictions.
What does: “without privileges” mean?

Lee wrote:

Flying IFR without privileges to use the full procedures (above the weather, ATZs and VFR chaos below) is an interesting problem.

I dare say these will be good reasons to eventually obtain the CBIR. Just need to stick it out for at least 35hrs in the mean time.

To really make use of the IR (CB or otherwise) you need a more capable aircraft – capable of cruising somewhere up towards FL200 which also means you need oxygen and preferably ice protection. Lots of the more common and basic singles are pretty marginal in terms of capability above FL100, and if you’re limited to below that then IFR routing in CAS becomes difficult. In the UK your route will go in and out of CAS at those levels, and when you leave you get ‘dumped’ and have no onward clearance into the next bit of CAS unless you call up and negotiate it, which if it is Class A will be impossible.

If you’re trying to solve some of the more commonly-experienced airspace access issues in the UK, note that the IR will not get you pop-up access to Class A, nor will it get you routing direct through the LTMA at the sort of levels we’d all like to go through the LTMA at if we could (FL50-FL100).

The other point is you really need to be planning to fly long enough routes to make the climb to altitude and the IFR routings worth it. Most of the IR training in the UK involves somewhat contrived IFR flights on a flight plan in Class A, e.g. Oxford to Cardiff. The distance is so short that the climb to altitude and the route necessary to keep the flight in CAS results in a large time and fuel burn overage compared to just flying the route IFR OCAS, which is what anyone would do if flying there simply because they wanted to get there.