Michal wrote:
just discovered some other apps are showing AIP SUP correctly. like AeroNotm
But this appears to have a trigger NOTAM. What happens when that NOTAM expires?
Airborne_Again wrote:
What happens when that NOTAM expires
What did you try to suggest to them? If you asked that they take each AIP SUP PDF file and re-paint that into their vector format, including all the additional information from the SUP AIP that sometimes spans many pages, I can imagine why they said no.
On the other hand, implementing a filter that finds out Trigger NOTAMs and automatically extending their validity period might be achievable. Or at least have someone look at each Trigger NOTAM and decide manually on the end date to use in Skydemon. If you suggest that, they may be more open to the idea. Calling @Rob_Hart
I suggested the first option – and volunteer to tell them when it´s not valid. But you are perhaps right. The other option can´t be that difficult..but obviously they are not willing to change their position. Even in communication with Czech ANSP they didn´t show too much cooperative attitude, don´t ask for source this info.
AIP SUP is a menace. My experience is that, at least in Sweden, lots of important things are hidden in the AIP SUPs without adequate NOTAMs to make them visible. It is a shame that the AIP SUP is so user unfriendly. For Sweden at least I know where to look for the AIP SUP. For other countries I have no clue.
It would be really good if Skydemon and autorouter were able to parse and include AIP SUP in their briefings.
Jan_Olieslagers wrote:
What is the exact purpose/function of the AIP SUP?
Things of semi-permanent nature.
You erect a wind-measurement mast before putting up wind-mills. The mast is gonna be there for maybe 6-9 months, and then be dismantled. The mast’s height is in an AIP SUP, the height of the permanent mills will be in the AIP.
You build a bridge or a large industrial complex or redo a road crossing, there will be cranes there for 2 years. It’s a long time, but it’s not forever.
NOTAMs are more short term events.
The NDB has blown a fuse. The tower will be closed next wednesday 2h early. The 10s carrier wave to remotely turn on the RWY lights is broken. There will be a skydiving meeting next week-end.
These conditions exist now that you need to know about, but they will be addressed and gone at a fixed date very soon.
As I mentioned earlier – NOTAM should not be in place more than 3 months. After that it should go into AIP SUP if not AIP directly. Not all countries are respecting this. So let not forget check AIP SUP. We learn something new every day.
Filing a flight plan with Skydemon
I have now filed 3 flight plans through SkyDemon and 2 have not been received by the Arrival, Destination and En-route airfields.
Has anyone had the same problem or could anyone suggest why this should occur.
This is my story:
I telephoned both departing and arriving airfields.
My departing airfield (Sleap EGCV) had not received my flight plan.
My destination airfield (Alderney CI – EGJA) had not received my flight plan.
The ATC at Alderney contacted Jersey ATC and returned my telephone call to say that Jersey had not received my flight plan and I should complete another flight plan. Please note that a flight plan for the Channel Islands must be filed at least 12 hours before departure.
In flight I tried to activate the flight plan and London Information said that there was a problem and after an anxious wait, in the air, on route, London Information said that the flight plan was now activated.
The whole scenario was very stressful.
My flight earlier this year to France had the same problem. London Information allowed me to create a flight plan whilst airborne. I am sure if they were busy this would not be possible and I would have had to land and create another flight plan.
SkyDemon sent an email reply to me which was abrupt and did not help with the situation. Shown Below:
As explained in the flightplan confirmation email, your flightplan was submitted to all of the listed addressees, and the email guarantees that the flightplan was indeed sent and is therefore on the system.
-————————————————————————————————
I would appreciate any assistance or information relating how flight plans are actually utilised and disseminated and maybe what was wrong with the flight plans submitted.
I have contact SkyDemon again and now waiting of a reply, hopefully an informative reply this time.
Regards John
I asuume a VFR flghtplan?
It is pretty haphazard if anyone receive it or not, and I would not be too bothered, to be honest. You have a legal requirement to file a flightplan, which you did and received confirmation on, so you have a pretty strong case. A VFR FP is not really being used by anyone.
My experience is that SkyDemon sends the flight plan basically to a single AFTN address for the departure FIR, which is supposedly the address of the unit who is to take care of sending the flight plan over to all other concerned units.
See this confirmation below:
Dear xxxx,
This email is confirmation that your flightplan has been successfully filed. A copy of the flightplan message, which has been sent to all recipients, is below for your reference.
Flightplans are like emails. Although we can guarantee that your flightplan has been sent to all addresses below, we cannot guarantee that the recipients will properly retain your flightplan. We therefore always advise telephoning the tower at your departure aerodrome to ensure they still have a copy of your flightplan ready before you begin your journey to the aerodrome.
(FPL———VG
Z42/L-V/S
LKRK0730
N0100A045 DCT TESPU DCT PEPIK DCT ERGOM/N0105A030 DCT NIPUR DCT
LHHO0328
EET/LZBB0134 LHCC0223 RMK/PILOT-, CREATED
BY SKYDEMON, SUPP INFO RQS KBLIHAEX DOF/160612)
Addresses: LKPRZPZX
In accordance with international practices, the supplementary information supplied by you will be stored safely by us. It will be sent to any of the recipients automatically should they request it.
You can now cancel, delay or close your flightplan by using the tools available to you on our website, at the address below.
http://www.skydemon.aero/members/flightplans.aspx
Sincerely,
SkyDemon Team
In this case the flight plan was sent only to the Czech ARO who were supposed to disseminate it and they did this job. In Central Europe this approach usually works well. In case of the disorganised UK system, it may not…
Addition:
Contrast this with what Homebriefing / Netbriefing does: when you file a flight plan, it is immediately sent to all addresses, because there is a human finding out what the necessary addresses are. In case of SkyDemon, you can also add a couple of addresses manually. If you can find out the addresses, it may help to alleviate such situations in the future.
