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ADS-B - what practical relevance in Europe?

The problem is – and much done previously – is that AFAIK there is no legally saleable device which displays both certified and uncertified ADS-B targets on the same display device.

I discuss the topic here. I have built (not installed) a product which can do this, among other stuff like emulating a WAAS GPS with ARINC429 outputs.

I find that attitude insulting to other pilots and a threat to my security.

Blame the CAA for that, and the man who has been running the scheme for years (Mr Gratton). They read EuroGA daily, and have appeared here under various nicknames, but nothing changes.

It could be considered a good reason to avoid the UK.

Just don’t fly below 2000ft Most of the TXP-off ops are down there, along with many flying school instructional flights.

Here is an interesting blog article

I think that would fragment the market even more. Currently it is so fragmented that nobody knows what to do.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter wrote:

The problem is – and much done previously – is that AFAIK there is no legally saleable device which displays both certified and uncertified ADS-B targets on the same display device.

PowerFLARM does. From the FLARM FAQ page: "PowerFLARM devices with an integrated 1090 MHz receiver will process all ADS-B Out (1090ES) messages, irrespective of the SIL, SDA, NIC, etc. parameters. "

Similarly, the specs for Air Avionics AT-1 combined FLARM unit/ADS-B receiver states that “ADS-B receiver for ADS-B IN (SIL=0-3)”.

I don’t understand why there should be any “legal” restrictions on uncertified devices like PowerFLARM and the AT-1.

ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

The Garmin G3X (certified and experimental versions) can include a GDL50R receiver which allows display of all ADS-B traffic regardless of SIL/SDA.

Avionics geek.
Somewhere remote in Devon, UK.

As I’ve repeated many times the biggest ‘bang for buck’ is Transponder ADSB-out and Pilot aware.

We flew a local on Sunday in a strong low-sun induced haze.
Southend was too busy for a traffic service, so we were left only with a poor look out, and PilotAware displayed in skydemon.
We saw approximately 10 contacts of which 4 were of specific interest. 1 of which was a potential conflict. We were watching him on SD for 7-8 mins and knew where to look when he eventually became visible. Then it was easy to remain safe.
Only 1 of the 10 we saw was a bearingless target.
On returning to the field my P2 continualy as required briefed me on exactly where 2 aircraft were, that were both arriving at our strip, so I could easily slow down and give them time to land and clear the runway.
As it turned out, one was a microlight and very slow, so if I’d only seen him on final visually from the base leg, I’d have followed, but caught him up way too quickly and needed a go-around. This was a 45min flight.
What’s not to like?

Last Edited by GA_Pete at 19 Dec 12:48
United Kingdom

The Garmin G3X (certified and experimental versions) can include a GDL50R receiver which allows display of all ADS-B traffic regardless of SIL/SDA.

Amazing. How did Garmin wangle that? Absolutely prohibited before.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

As it turned out, one was a microlight and very slow, so if I’d only seen him on final visually from the base leg, I’d have followed, but caught him up way too quickly and needed a go-around. This was a 45min flight.

Makes me wonder. Don’t you use radio?

The elephant is the circulation
ENVA ENOP ENMO, Norway

Peter wrote:

Absolutely prohibited before.

How was that prohibited? By a TSO, EASA reg, ….?

ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

Airborne_Again wrote:

How was that prohibited? By a TSO, EASA reg, ….?

The TSO on certified displays prevents non-certified ADS-B traffic display. However the G3X isn’t a TSO’d product and neither is the GDL50R – both are PMA and approved under STC.

Avionics geek.
Somewhere remote in Devon, UK.

Makes me wonder. Don’t you use radio?

Yes we do. Safety com.
We’re bordering Class D at the strip. I was on the Class D feq while this was being observed, just before changing to Safety com to announce my arrival, position and intentions.
Infact that demonstrates another reason this all works so well for me.

United Kingdom

When thinking about an ADS-B transponder most people instinctively want the ADS-B In. But let me argue for a moment that ADS-B Out is more valuable.

Very few GA aircraft are transmitting ADS-B presently. Some are transmitting Flarm, some are transmitting PilotAware signals.

Some aircraft can detect Flarm. Some can detect PilotAware. But almost everyone who can detect some form device can detect ADS-B signals.

So if you try for ADS-B In, or Flarm in or PilotAware in, you’ll only have a sub-set of transmitting aircraft, and none of the non-transmitting aircraft.

If you try for ADS-B out, then pretty much everyone who can see any traffic, can see you (including those who aren’t transmitting anything but have a cheap receiver). So they are in a position to take avoiding action. So long as one of you takes avoiding action, then the accident is avoided. So ADS-B Out is, in my opinion, a bigger priority than ADS-B in.

Having said that, I totally agree with GA_Pete. The best ‘bank for your buck’ is ADS-B out in the aircraft transponder and Pilot Aware for your tablet. ADS-B out will ensure that a lot of people can see you, and PilotAware will give you ADS-B in, Pilot Aware In, and estimated range for mode A, C & S (but not direction).

I also connect my Pilot Aware to my phone and in doing so get SkyEcho in and Pilot Aware’s internet derived traffic in too. It’s the best of both worlds.

EIWT Weston, Ireland
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