The Aztec is nice yes but it is over the hard limit of 1999 kg for Europe. Most people will stall on that.
Nice write up indeed and perfectly clear why there are not too many takers. Complex systems, lack of redundancy and less than exciting cruise speed.
So in the 2×160 hp class the Twin Commanche seems a very much better alternative.
Ed Swearingen designed the Comanche, which is why it doesn’t look like the usual Piper flying dugong. 
AdamFrisch wrote:
it doesn’t look like the usual Piper flying dugong.
I think the Apache and Aztec A are quite pretty. It’s only when you get to the later Aztecs, especially the E and F, where function overtakes form.
The Seneca is also not bad looking. The Navajo and Chieftain are just rugged and workmanlike.
The Apache is a Stinson design, it started as a 3-engines ship!
This guy did a great exercice in transparency about his apache: http://realcostofownership.blogspot.com/2013/08/my-cheap-twin-piper-apache-n1234p.html
I almost bought one in 2015 – it was owned by a new airline pilot who had bought it a couple of years before. He went on to remove the seats in the back and to replace them with a mattress, and he flew the heck out of of it all across the US to reach 1500tt before applying to the airlines.
The twin Comanche is without doubt a much better travelling machine – but capital costs, insurance and training requirements are probably not the same either.
I’m not sure why people are so fixated about the 1999kg limit. The delta in cost is really not significant compared to all the other expenses. I think my tab over the past 2 years at Eurocontrol hovers around 1200 euros (and 30% of that is some weird fees from UK). And don’t get me started on the 1999kg STC for the Seneca..
wleferrand wrote:
I’m not sure why people are so fixated about the 1999kg limit. The delta in cost is really not significant compared to all the other expenses. I think my tab over the past 2 years at Eurocontrol hovers around 1200 euros (and 30% of that is some weird fees from UK). And don’t get me started on the 1999kg STC for the Seneca..
Agreed. The saying “strain a gnat, but swallow a camel” comes to mind. The enroute charges will be the least of your costs as an aircraft owner. A rounding error.
Thirded
wleferrand wrote:
I’m not sure why people are so fixated about the 1999kg limit.
Very simple. People don’t like to pay money. It’s been shown many times also in other issues that most pilots and many owners who fly their own plane do so at a shoestring budget they have to justify to family and themselfs. The Eurocontrol tax issue is one of those things which CAN be avoided comparatively easily by avoiding airplanes which are in excess of 1999kg. So most people looking for budget rides will avoid a 2000 kg airplane like the plague and not even look at it. No matter what the actual costs are. People don’t know about the amounts spent and therefore naturally assume them to be prohibitive. In the day and age of mandiatory handling and all this, not an astonishing line of thought.
As for 1999 kg STC’s, well, it makes a lot of sense for people who fly within that limit. That means 2-3 people. Why pay if you don’t have to. Same goes for Jet Prop STC as well. Clearly, this means you have to adhere to the weight, but you know in the back of your head that it can take some kgs more structurally. Which most of the time they do anyhow.
Wow, if they just weren’t so damn expensive to operate…*
Very clean, great paint, new props, EU VAT paid…
http://www.planecheck.com?ent=da&id=45177 local copy
* Of course, if they weren’t, then they would be more expensive to buy…
Wow indeed. Looks like a very nice plane.
That price is very low, probably influenced by a few things. Of course it is above 2000 kg, which will already take it of the radar of many buyers.
but I suppose if the budget for a plane purchase was maybe 150k, then from the purchase price there stays a lot of money to fly before it gets more expensive. Say, you have a SEP with 300 Euros per hour cost for 150k and buy this one for 56k and add a WAAS GPS for 3000 upgrade… so 60k. Remains 90 k. That plane will maybe cost 600 Euros per hour to operate, so take the additional cost and it will take 300 hours before the Baron has eaten up the same money than a comparable SEP. That is maybe 4-5 years of flying for many people. And then sell it to the US.
That paintscheme… this would not be the plane which was the subject of a thread regarding painting in Lithuania, would it?
