Well, one could ask why the UK is accepting EU papers for 2 years while the EU is not accepting UK (PPL level) papers at all.
Many aspects about the situation are far from bilateral, when actually they should be. It’s obviously a politically driven landscape. Tactically, “you” always shaft the party which wishes to leave – because tactically the best time to shaft somebody is when they are on their back foot. Divorce works on exactly the same principle, for example, where (as is usually the case) one party wants to leave more than the other.
To take this further one would get into pure politics. Some people have suggested, now that brexit is done, that brexit discussion can be returned, perhaps limited to the politics thread. It is a good point. I have thought about it and I am no more keen on it than I was before. One look at social media makes it clear this is incendiary as ever, and on an international forum such as ours there are additional dimensions which make modding harder (national/nationalist axes, etc) partly because most of the mainland is/was anti brexit, and modding posters from particular countries is extra incendiary 
I just don’t want to do it; it’s not worth it.
I think the 2 years have to do with the number of IAA examiners the U.K. had (RyanAir & Co), the whole business would stop if the U.K. does not recognise these (also if you add new examiners & instructors who SOLI’ed following their ATO or AOC guidelines), it’s different on EU side, this would explain why U.K. would accept EASA papers no matter what
The problem comes back when U.K. PPL holders are looking for signatures, it will be a nightmare as U.K. never recognised the free blanket for non-U.K. examiners and everything had to go to CAA on a case by case, I imagine most of those will have to get U.K. papers as well?
Well one had hoped that today would have marked the end of the accusations that the UK is being punished. The UK has got what it wanted and the EU have kept its pillars in place. It’s a shame that some Brits are still bitter. According, even to Boris Johnson, Michael Gove, and even Nigel Farrage, the UK has got a great deal.
So please Peter stop this bitterness now. You cannot expect the eg Germans to have any sympathy when Brexiteers publish things like “we didn’t win 2 world wars to be told what to do by a Kraut”. The French have suffered similar insults and accusations and then we find ex chancellor and Brexiteer Nigel Lawson and even Boris Johnson’s father applying for French nationality. Even you have wondered on these threads whether or not to take up a Czech passport. So I say again please stop the rhetoric and deal with the facts
I have not met any Frenchman or woman here wanting to punish the UK. We wish you well but we also recognise that because you are now a competitor, perhaps not too well.
Thankyou
FWIW I do think the UK got a good deal. Better than I expected. I am not “bitter”; I just would not (if I was the EU) have done the instant cancellation of licenses which after all were issued under “my” oversight, by a member country which is no longer a member. It is like me issuing you with a permission to fly from my strip, and when you no longer attend the masonic lodge I am a member of, I throw you out. Personally, I would never do such a thing, because I do not regard it as civilised.
Had Brussels previously allowed the use of the NPPL across the EU, and pulled the plug on that on 1st Jan 2021, that would be more understandable. But an EASA PPL issued by the UK, with privileges x y and z, should not have those privileges modified during its validity no matter what happens politically. Especially as the license was UK issued, the UK has an ICAO seat, EASA or Brussels do not have an ICAO seat, and every aspect of the license was issued with Brussels’ authorisation.
Whether doing so is “punishment” is debatable. I’d say it is just playing hardball in the negotiations, while trying to discourage other countries leaving in the future. I believe Sweden and Poland, not to mention Hungary and others “down there”, have been “looking at it”.
Each of us lives by our respective morals (or lack of morals) and mine are above
As for your other quotes, I have never posted those or have held those views.
The Czech passport I am entitled to, and a visit to the Czech embassy has been on a post-it pad on the wall here for at least 10 years
It depends which sector but for aviation it seems U.K. got a super great trade deal for CAT, but for average GA PPL the deal is not great but most of it has to do with “sub-ICAO and sub-Class2 medical” privileges and that U.K. had which other countries sadly just don’t have, why this is expected to be mutually recognised? why a “trade deal” should cover the average citizen privileges*?
For other sectors, it depends what you are talking about for pharmaceutical & services it’s fiasco (maybe 20% of GDP with half of it is exported) but we got a super deal on 0.1% fish GDP
*Note that one has to distinguish “companies trade $-privileges” from “citizen non-$ privileges”, the latter is was not even discussed in “trade deal negotiations” post-Jan21 but rather under “citizen rights withdrawal agreement” pre-Jan20, I think that opportunity was missed for U.K. LAPL holders…
The CAT deal is pretty good; only cabotage has been removed (but the airlines will solve that by setting up EU based companies).
UK sub-ICAO medicals were never valid outside the UK. The NPPL was valid in France (and France is still free to continue that, I guess, if they wanted to) but only with a Class 2+. Just like the French microlight PPL (no medical needed) is valid France only.
The UK LAPL is apparently lost for flying outside the UK. With even a full Class 2 medical. You can’t even fly a G-reg on it outside the UK! That’s another bad example of a license issued by the UK with Brussels’ authorisation, having its privileges limited.
Well it is finally done now, and I’m sure people will get on fine. I saw on the news the great disappointment the reporter had in noting that there were no delays at Dover. He had to dig as far down as pointing out 6 lorries were turned around at Holyhead because of incorrect paperwork. Pretty desperate stuff.
I do get that Europe must be terrified that other countries will go, Italy, Denmark seem high on the cards and didn’t Macron himself suggest that if the french had a vote they’d probably choose to leave? Perhaps this is what they’ve been trying to do with not wanting to recognise the licences.
Outside of the infringements department. The CAA seem to be making positive noises about GA. Let’s see what happens.
Yes glad it’s all done and things are moving on forward, I am sure LAPL holders will get sorted at least for flying in France and Ireland, mostly as gentlemen agreements rather than big talks !
I reckon you are right.
Peter wrote:
I just would not (if I was the EU) have done the instant cancellation of licenses which after all were issued under “my” oversight, by a member country which is no longer a member. It is like me issuing you with a permission to fly from my strip, and when you no longer attend the masonic lodge I am a member of, I throw you out. Personally, I would never do such a thing, because I do not regard it as civilised.
How is it the other way? With a non UK EASA license, what can you fly in the UK? Can I fly a G-reg aircraft in the UK for instance? LAPL or PPL ?
